Thursday, February 15, 2001(Private/Phone)
Participants: Mary (Michael), Rodney (Zacharie), and Nicky (Candace)
Elias arrives at 1:29 PM. (Arrival time is 21 seconds.)
ELIAS: Good morning!
RODNEY: Good morning, Mr. Elias! (Elias chuckles) There are two of us here.
ELIAS: And how shall we proceed?
RODNEY: We have a couple of questions.
ELIAS: Very well.
RODNEY: Have Nicky and I had focuses together, and if we have, how many?
ELIAS: Yes, and I may express numbering of focuses shared, 14.
RODNEY: Fourteen. Has there been a base element between these focuses as to friendship, counterpart activities ... as antagonists?
ELIAS: And shall you not investigate this and express your discovery to myself?
RODNEY: Okay... (Elias laughs) Yes! We have done a little of that. I'll tell you what our hints are.
ELIAS: Very well.
RODNEY: I sense that we've been shepherds together, caretakers of animals, like as to watching over them - something to do with being outdoors, and something to do with the kind of walking sticks that shepherds use.
ELIAS: Correct.
RODNEY: We have done that?
ELIAS: Yes.
RODNEY: Could you indicate when and where that occurred?
ELIAS: No. (Elias smiles)
RODNEY: No?
ELIAS: I shall allow you to continue your investigation.
RODNEY: Ah! Okay. (Nicky laughs)
ELIAS: (Laughing) I am quite aware of whom I am speaking with, and that both of you hold the ability to be investigating and offering yourselves this information, and are inquiring of myself in not putting forth your own initiative! Ha ha!
RODNEY: (Laughs) Okay, the second one I have is, have we ever been in a focus where Nicky was a military officer? And I'm thinking particularly of a Spanish or Indian ethnicity.
ELIAS: Yes, you are correct. Hispanic.
RODNEY: Hispanic.
ELIAS: Yes.
RODNEY: Wonderful. Can you give me a hint as to what my part was (Elias chuckles) in that relationship?
ELIAS: (Laughing) I shall continue to be encouraging of you to be investigating! (Nicky laughs)
RODNEY: Thank you, sir!
ELIAS: And shall we continue playing this game? Ha ha ha!
RODNEY: I have one more. (Elias laughs) We were both engaged in a rather dedicated way as either students or researchers or teachers, something of that order.
ELIAS: You are correct, and what is your impression as to the identification of roles?
RODNEY: I sense ... hmm. You mean one of us was like the teacher, one of us was like the student, in that sense?
ELIAS: You engage action cooperatively, not as one teaching and one learning.
RODNEY: I had that sense.
NICKY: And is that similar to what's going on now?
RODNEY: I have a sense that that's going on now, very much so.
ELIAS: In what you may term to be an abstract means. It is not being created in the same type of imagery.
RODNEY: Okay. My sense is that the imagery or the expression in the other focus was one of exploration.
ELIAS: Research.
RODNEY: Research, really. I'll take that as homework.
ELIAS: Very well.
RODNEY: All right.
ELIAS: Ha ha ha! And what do you view in correlation of that focus to this focus? (Pause) You have already offered yourselves an impression that you are creating a similar type of action, incorporating different imagery. Therefore, what is your impression as to the similarity?
RODNEY: The similarity would be that we stimulate each other, number one, in ... okay. My sense is that we use each other in some way to heighten our understanding, and my hint on that would be that it has to do with consciousness in some way.
ELIAS: Correct. Therefore your direction is similar, and you incorporate an action between yourselves to be sparking the curiosity and the understanding of each other, enhancing the experience.
RODNEY: Correct - very good. Nicky has had a focus in Egypt, and I have very early connections with Egypt. As a very, very young boy, one of my favorite pictures was seeing my father sitting on top of a camel standing in front of the Great Pyramid. With that kind of coming into memory, I suspect that our research might have been in the area of Egypt.
ELIAS: This is another focus which incorporates a similar action and roles; you are correct.
RODNEY: We were both there together?
ELIAS: Yes.
RODNEY: Thank you! Those are the only hints I've had, so I'll have to work on the other 11.
ELIAS: Ha ha ha! Very well!
RODNEY: Elias, I've never asked you what essence I've been fragmented from, and I was wondering if you'd tell me the family and the name of that essence, if you would.
ELIAS: Very well. (Slight pause) Fragmenting essence, translated tone, Braun, B-R-A-U-N.
RODNEY: Braun. Can I...
ELIAS: Essence family...
RODNEY: Can I guess at that?
ELIAS: You may.
RODNEY: Milumet.
ELIAS: No.
RODNEY: No, okay.
ELIAS: And you may allow yourself to recognize that this is a guess, and allow yourself the recognition between a guess and an impression.
RODNEY: Okay.
ELIAS: I may express to you the fragmenting essence associates with Sumafi.
RODNEY: Sumafi!
ELIAS: Yes.
RODNEY: And it was only one essence involved in my fragmentation?
ELIAS: Yes.
RODNEY: Thank you. My next question concerns a message involving tapping on my fingers. I was reading an advertisement for a magazine, and it caught my eye and I was thinking that I might like to subscribe to it, and then I thought it might be ... some of these magazines are more sensational and reactive to what is going on, like with a propaganda agenda, and that thought crossed my mind, and then I felt a tapping on the end of my thumb on my right hand. I noticed that and I wondered if it was saying ... well, I recognized it was saying, "Pay attention." And then I thought that because it was on my right hand that it might be saying this would not be a worthwhile pursuit to be spending my energy reading this magazine, and then I choose to investigate the magazine anyway, so I subscribed to it. (Elias chuckles)
And I was wondering if you would validate, one, the tapping, whether it was myself or whether it was you (Elias smiles and nods), 'cause we spoke of this before, and what was the significance of that message, if it was a message?
ELIAS: (Chuckling) You have already offered yourself the identification of the message. You are correct in your interpretation of your impression concerning this action, and I shall validate to you that this action of your finger is an interaction of myself.
RODNEY: Thank you!
ELIAS: You are quite welcome.
RODNEY: Was I correct in assessing it to be, because it was on my right hand, that it would not be worthwhile?
ELIAS: You are correct. Although, as always, you ultimately hold the choice and free will to be creating what you choose to be creating, and so you have.
RODNEY: Okay, I see. So I've given myself the opportunity to see whether or not this is a worthwhile pursuit.
ELIAS: Correct.
RODNEY: Thank you!
ELIAS: You are welcome, my friend.
RODNEY: I have another one that's similar to that. I woke up one morning, and when I went to pick up something, I had a sharp ... it was painful on the last knuckle of my left thumb when I picked something up between my thumb and my forefinger, and I thought that it was a message. The message was that I was feeling as if I could not grasp what was going on around me, that I felt confused. Is that a correct assessment?
ELIAS: Yes. This is your own communication to yourself.
RODNEY: Understood; thank you. Was I accurate in assessing that message?
ELIAS: Yes.
RODNEY: Thank you.
ELIAS: You are welcome, my friend.
RODNEY: (Laughs, and Elias laughs) Number six ... I have these all nicely numbered this morning.
ELIAS: Ah! Incorporating organization! (They all laugh)
RODNEY: As a good Sumafi should!
ELIAS: Ha ha ha! (Rodney laughs)
RODNEY: Nicky uses her relationship with her doctors as a bridge to get information so that she can more efficiently work with herself in noticing what's going on for her, in where she needs to move. And I was wondering, doctors always seem to be suggesting tests, and every time they give me a test I come out with a fantastic bill of health, and I have one who's suggesting that I do a stress test. He's saying it's not absolutely necessary, but he would like to do it.
And you know, sitting on the opposite side of the desk, so to speak, I sense that if you keep looking for things that are wrong with you, you're gonna find something that's wrong with you, and if I don't go looking for something that's wrong, it's not going to be there. That's a rather strong belief that I have, especially regarding doctors. So my inclination is to say to hell with it, I don't want to go doing this. It doesn't seem like a worthwhile activity for me, and I was wondering if you would comment on my sense of knowing what's really going on here.
ELIAS: (Chuckling) I may express to you, my friend, that within your perception and what you create in relation to your beliefs, in your vernacular what is REALLY occurring is what you create. You reinforce your beliefs by offering yourself physical evidences of those beliefs.
Now; in terms of "real" reality, there is no outside "real" reality which is not created by any one individual's perception. The official real reality is created by each individual through their individual perceptions. Therefore, your reality is created in one manner, and Candace creates her reality in a different manner.
Now; what holds significance in your allowance of yourselves to view the differences in how you manipulate your own energies and create your individual realities through your individual perceptions is that you offer information to each other to be incorporating a broader expression of perception as you allow yourselves to view the differences, and in viewing the differences, you may recognize the areas in which you each express judgments in relation to yourselves and your own beliefs, and in which you express judgments concerning differences.
And in this, you allow yourselves, in the incorporation of this information, to open more to your periphery and view that the manner in which you perceive your reality is not necessarily absolute. Other expressions may be incorporated also, providing you with more choices and other avenues of exploration.
Therefore, in the incorporation of sharing your perceptions with each other in objective terms, so to speak, you accomplish two actions, offering yourselves information concerning yourselves and how you each are creating your individual realities and the beliefs that are influencing of your perception, and you also allow yourself more of an expression of freedom in choice, in recognizing that the methods that you choose are merely choices and are influenced by your individual directions and beliefs, and are not absolutes.
Therefore, in relation to what you have expressed, Zacharie, in what you create within your reality, your assessment is that if you are not offering yourself information through interaction with your medical sciences, you shall not create a malady.
RODNEY: Correct.
ELIAS: If you are seeking out a malady through the incorporation of your medical sciences, you shall be creating that. Within your perception and your reality, you do create these types of expressions. Within the reality of another individual, they may incorporate a different action, and that shall be efficient within their reality, and they shall create in their own manner.
I may express to you, Candace and Michael both, in counterpart action that they share, create a similar type of movement and association with medical sciences, allowing themselves to incorporate that type of interaction at times and offering themselves information concerning what they may be creating in objective terms, which offers each of them more of a visual perspective concerning their creations; and therefore, as they incorporate this visual perspective in relation to the physical creation, their beliefs influence their perception, allowing them to be manipulating energy more efficiently to be affecting of what they have created.
RODNEY: I see the distinction between both of them and myself, and I hear that you're validating my assessment of my own belief system, that if I don't go looking ... my perception is that if I don't go looking for it, it's not really there.
ELIAS: Correct.
RODNEY: Okay. Thank you very much, sir.
ELIAS: You are quite welcome.
RODNEY: Next question: do I have any famous focuses that I might be able to identify and get some information on them, regarding their writings or their picture?
ELIAS: I may express to you, yes, you do incorporate what you term to be famous focuses, and once again, I shall express to you the encouragement to be listening to your impressions and investigating this within self. (Smiling)
RODNEY: Okay. I've always, since I was a very, very early child, ... I guess the man called Einstein, the famous physicist, is a symbol. I think perhaps his picture is a symbol for many people in my generation because he was such a famous individual, and yet I've always felt a particular draw to him. And I'm wondering, am I guessing? Is this guesswork? Or is this in some way an honest impression?
ELIAS: I may express to you, you are offering yourself information through a genuine impression and draw, although I may also express to you that you do not incorporate the focus of this individual.
RODNEY: Would it be a counterpart action of some sort?
ELIAS: There is a counterpart action which is incorporated in that focus that you do participate with, and you also engage a focus which is known to that individual, and you are expressing a type of relationship to that individual.
RODNEY: Okay. If I may repeat that for clarification, I have a focus who knew this individual?
ELIAS: Yes.
RODNEY: I sense that that focus was female. (Pause)
ELIAS: Yes, you are correct.
RODNEY: And I also sense that that female was ... well, let me put it this way. To my knowledge, this individual held a life - and I'm saying that only to me, that it wasn't generally the case in the popular knowledge - that that individual, to me, held a more secretive life regarding his relationships with members of the opposite sex, i.e., I was not aware of them until recently, and I sense that the woman in question, who was my focus, was also unaware of his being with other women.
ELIAS: Correct.
RODNEY: That focus was not his wife, was it?
ELIAS: No.
RODNEY: Okay. Thank you.
ELIAS: You are welcome.
RODNEY: Well, did she have an intimate relationship with him?
ELIAS: Briefly.
RODNEY: Briefly; thank you very much!
ELIAS: You are quite welcome, my friend.
RODNEY: Question: is suicide simply another way that some people choose to disengage? It's so easy to place judgment on that act, and in opening up to acceptance - Nicky and I were talking about this - it seems to us that it truly matters not that someone would choose this way to go.
My sense of it, however, is that although it matters not in choosing to disengage in this fashion, one could be emphasizing the challenge that brought them to that. In other wise, it's kind of stamping it with a stamp of finality, and if in so doing, do they not have that also to work through in transition?
ELIAS: In a manner of speaking, yes. I may express to you, you are correct; it is a choice.
In this, generally speaking - although not always - individuals that incorporate this action of disengagement through what you term to be suicide are incorporating a physical action objectively which is expressive of their own experience in desperation, and the communication which is offered in that experience and emotional expression of desperation is the overwhelming recognition of denial of their ability to be creating choice. This denial of self may be expressed in such a definite manner that the subjective communication becomes extreme to be gaining the objective awareness in attention to what the individual is expressing and creating in that time framework, which is a continuation of denial of choice.
Now; within your physical terms, figuratively speaking, tremendous denial of choice within an individual may be, in a manner of speaking, an excruciating experience, for it is quite contrary to your natural state of being, which incorporates choice.
RODNEY: What I hear, what I'm sensing, is this could be both. On one hand, it could be a phenomenal wake-up call as they move into transition, that they notice this is what they create - that's one possibility - and therefore they are better prepared to cope or to widen their awareness as to what they are really doing.
Then on the other hand, it could be just the opposite. It could carry over into transition, so that they have a similarly difficult time in transition widening their awareness as to what they're really doing.
ELIAS: Let me express to you, in the incorporation of engaging this action of suicide in relation to the expression of desperation, the individual may disengage physical focus but, generally speaking, that individual shall not immediately incorporate the action of transition but rather shall continue to be creating objective imagery incorporating the same issue.
RODNEY: Wow.
ELIAS: In this action of suicide, the individual is incorporating an action to be escaping what they are creating, and to be altering their experience in relation to the issue that they have presented to themselves; but the action of disengagement from this physical dimension does not necessarily alter the experience.
As I have expressed to other individuals, you may be disengaging, and what you are accomplishing in disengagement from this particular physical focus is merely an action which is quite similar to that of physically relocating your physical self to another country. You continue to occupy you. YOU incorporate YOU as you relocate. You do not leave "you" in the previous physical location.
Therefore as you disengage, this action of disengagement is very similar to what you incorporate within your physical dimension in relocating your physical self to what you term to be a foreign country. The environment may appear different, the language may appear different, and your surroundings, so to speak, may appear differently to you, but you continue to be you.
RODNEY: So, what that says to me is that they continue in an objective environment to cope with the issue of desperation of lack of choice. They continue with that.
ELIAS: Correct.
NICKY: Well, won't they continue in whatever state of mind they were in, when they disengage by other means - accidents, diseases, whatever?
ELIAS: Not necessarily.
NICKY: In what manner? How is it different?
ELIAS: The choice to be disengaging through the manifestation of disease is a choice to be incorporating a specific method which is acceptable in your belief systems as to disengagement. It is the choice to be incorporating a specific type of method. You always choose how you shall be disengaging, and in this, your beliefs are influencing as to your choice of disengagement from this physical focus.
But in the situation of this particular action, incorporating the experience of desperation - which I have stated, not all actions of suicide incorporate that experience - but in those that do incorporate this experience of desperation, the individual is creating a perception of an absolute lack of choice, and therefore is not allowing for their value fulfillment, and therefore chooses in relation to their beliefs their escape route, so to speak.
But you do not disengage your objective awareness as you disengage physical focus. You continue to incorporate your objective awareness subsequent to your disengagement of physical focus or death.
NICKY: No matter which way you choose to disengage?
ELIAS: Correct. This is why you have incorporated this action of transition, to be shedding the objective awareness which is associated with this physical dimension and to be shedding the belief systems which are associated with this physical dimension.
Therefore, ALL of you that disengage physical focus from this physical dimension do continue with some aspect of objective awareness temporarily, and move into the action of transition to be disengaging that objective awareness and your beliefs associated with this physical dimension.
Now; in these particular situations of suicide enacted in what you term to be a state of desperation, you are merely moving your attention from one area of consciousness to another area of consciousness, similar from movement from one country to another country. You are not disengaging your beliefs, and you are incorporating movement into nonphysical areas of consciousness with the full incorporation of your objective awareness, and that objective awareness continues to create imagery that appears quite physical and in relation to this physical dimension.
Now; there are also other expressions that may be incorporated that appear unfamiliar and not quite in alignment with your actual physical dimension, for you may be incorporating creating physical imagery in your own expression which may manifest in relation to your beliefs in a slightly different manner, for the only incorporation of imagery shall be your own.
RODNEY: If I could give an example, if a man, in a deep religious belief, felt that when he disengaged he was going to heaven and had a clear concept of what that might be like - that miracles were possible there - that if he were to disengage in a diseased body, he might create through his belief systems the objective imagery of an individual in heaven healing him? Is this the kind of way, as an example, of how a belief system would carry through to the objective imagery after disengagement?
ELIAS: Yes, this may be the incorporation of an example, and this is a possibility. It is not an absolute, for an individual may hold quite strong beliefs and be quite expressive in those beliefs while engaging physical focus in this physical dimension, and may upon disengagement move into the action of transition and may not necessarily incorporate this interim time framework, so to speak, of creating a manifestation of their beliefs. It is dependent upon the individual and their choice of movement in the moment of disengagement.
RODNEY: This raises a question for me. When my mother disengaged, she was surrounded by an awareness of beings that were visiting her constantly for some months while she was in the nursing home. And if I understood you correctly, you said that she was viewing her other focuses. Does this imply that she was moving directly or more quickly or more easily into essence and bypassing objective imagery, or at least less objective imagery and less time, if you will, in transition?
ELIAS: Not less time in transition.
RODNEY: Not less time?
ELIAS: Less incorporation of interim, or in your common vernacular, in between objective expression of imagery prior to movement into the action of transition.
RODNEY: You're saying there was less time in that in-between?
ELIAS: In actuality, this individual allowed almost an immediate movement into transition.
RODNEY: I see. Is she still in transition? (Pause)
ELIAS: No.
RODNEY: No? In my sequential time framework, would you indicate how long she was there? (Pause)
ELIAS: In an identification of your physical incorporation of time, movement beyond the action of transition may be associated with your previous year.
RODNEY: My previous year?
ELIAS: Correct.
RODNEY: We don't have time for a real answer on this, but I'd like to ask a quick question as something we might follow up on. You've recently identified that emotion is a function of communication.
ELIAS: Correct.
RODNEY: And not, as we understood it previously, a reaction to something that was going on with us.
ELIAS: Correct.
RODNEY: Now, my question is ... the two base aspects of this physical dimension are emotion and sexuality.
ELIAS: Correct.
RODNEY: Now, I associate ... there's a huge belief system surrounding sexuality?
ELIAS: Correct.
RODNEY: We see it as its base element as being reproductive. And my question to you is, aside from these things, aside from the gender aspects and the biology aspects, does sexuality have a basic function in the same way that emotion has a basic function that we were not aware of?
ELIAS: The basic function of sexuality is manifestation.
RODNEY: Ah, okay. So, regardless of sex, it has to do with how we create our reality?
ELIAS: Yes.
RODNEY: Have you discussed this previously?
ELIAS: No.
RODNEY: Could we discuss it at some further moment?
ELIAS: We shall.
RODNEY: Thank you! (Elias laughs) Thank you very much!
ELIAS: You are quite welcome! Ha ha ha ha!
RODNEY: As always, this has been most informative.
ELIAS: Ha ha ha! And within our next meeting, perhaps, Candace, you shall be less of a little mouse and more interactive! (Rodney laughs)
NICKY: (Laughing) How do I fit in between the two long-winded people that I deal with?
ELIAS: HA HA HA! I may express to you, you have exhibited quite an ability to be expressive and interactive!
NICKY: (Laughing) Yes, I know! (Elias laughs)
RODNEY: That's particularly amusing coming from such a chatterbox, wouldn't you say, Elias?
ELIAS: (Laughs) And I may express to you both encouragement in your exploration together and your interaction with each other. Be playful, and offer yourself a continuation of enjoyment.
To you each, in tremendous affection and encouragement ... fear not, Candace, you shall not continue in confusion forever! Ha ha ha! (Nicky and Rodney laugh) Ha ha! To you both this day, I express to you quite lovingly, au revoir.
RODNEY: Au revoir.
Elias departs at 2:29 PM.
(c)2002 Mary Ennis, All Rights Reserved
Copyright 2001 Mary Ennis, All Rights Reserved.