Sunday, February 9, 1997 © 1997
Participants: Mary (Michael), Vicki (Lawrence), Ron (Olivia), Cathy (Shynla), Gail (William), Bob (Simon), Jene (Rudim), Norm (Stephen), Reta (Dehl), and Drew (Matthew).
Note: This session is what I call a real face-rubber!

Elias arrives at 6:46 PM. (Time was twenty-five seconds)

ELIAS: Good evening. As we continue our investigation of unofficial information this evening, we shall also incorporate time. This is a great creator of unofficial information. Time, as you know, is a creation of perception, although as with all symbols, it is a thing in itself also. You think of elements as things composed of things. Some things are not composed of tangible things. Time is one of these. It is a dimension within itself. It also creates dimensions. The energy within consciousness that has been designated to create the element of time has become its own thing in itself.

Time factors are relative to physical focuses, as we have expressed previously. We have spoken of many different subject matters which time is influencing of. We have spoken of bleed-throughs within dimensions. Time, in this, is very influential in the creation of these bleed-throughs. Some bleed-throughs are direct results of time interactions. This is also part of unofficial information.

We have spoken of unofficial information that you witness, as in your extraterrestrials and your sightings of these, and your questioning of how this is possible and your questioning of the reality other existences. As I have stated previously, there are many different explanations of circumstances that are related to viewings that you encounter. One explanation also involves your dimension of time.

If you are thinking in terms of things, you may think of time as a thing which disperses itself into many other things, creating many dimensions of itself. Time creates many of the existing dimensions itself. This is different from areas of consciousness, of which we have spoken previously. They are as different rooms within a house; each room symbolizing a different dimension, but the house contains all of the rooms; the house being the element of time.

We have spoken of blinking in and blinking out and intervals of time. We have spoken of the symphony of consciousness, and you as the unexpressed notes. The expressed symphony are the links of consciousness, which are creating of all. They are in all time frames, and everywhere at once. You are singularly focused as the unexpressed notes. Within the subject of time intervals, we have spoken previously of the rhythm of your particular time creation, your dimension of time; which within your created dimension of reality you also encompass many sub-dimensions, for all of your time periods exist simultaneously, although you view them linearly. So, within one time reality dimension there are many time dimensions that you see as past, future, and present.

All time frameworks are not completely, consistently, immaculately precise within a certain rhythm. As your scientists already are aware, time is flexible. It is elastic. Therefore, the intervals are not spaced evenly. Within all other dimensions, the intervals are not spaced evenly either. Therefore, at ’times’ (grinning) these intervals intersect. You may have one dimension of time intervals blinking on and off, say as a string of blinking lights which do not blink precisely within an exact rhythm. As you place another string of blinking lights next to this first string, it also blinks not precisely in rhythm. Therefore, eventually some of the lights will blink simultaneously.

In this same manner, you experience bleed-throughs within time frameworks. You experience bleed-throughs within your own reality of other focuses. You may experience deja vu, of which we have spoken previously. I offer you more understanding now of this experience of deja vu. I have expressed previously that this is involved with your time element and your perception of time. You hold your attention singularly; but although you project a focus into one singular time framework, you innately know your own multidimensionality. Therefore, you are receptive to recognizing bleed-throughs of unofficial information. You do not always hold an explanation for this information, for you have forgotten intentionally. Therefore, you create new explanations, such as a feeling of deja vu.

You also experience bleed-throughs of other dimensions. These bleed-throughs, within time frameworks, are not limited to your own reality. Some of your bleed-throughs may be an intersection of an entirely foreign, to your way of thinking, existence that you may witness realistically within your waking objective experience. Individuals view crafts and hold no explanation for their existence, as they also disappear quite quickly. These, at times, also are intersections of time intervals. This is unofficial information.

I have expressed to you previously that you experience unofficial information continuously. You are now learning to recognize this unofficial information and partially, partially, accept some of this unofficial information, although much of this information you do not accept for it is within direct conflict of your accepted belief systems. This causes conflict. (Typing this session is causing me conflict. I may rub my face completely off before I’m finished!) Each of you listens to the concept of ’You create your reality.’ As we have stated previously, this is a concept, within your way of thinking; for each choice that you engage also engages an element of unofficial information. You do not recognize the unofficial information, for you do not allow your attention to perceive this information. Therefore, you are not always satisfied with your choices. I say to you, if you are looking to yourselves you shall view that every breath that you engage, every choice, no matter how small within your perception you may view it to be, is a conscious choice.

We have spoken previously that you are not a victim of a subconscious direction. You are not being led through this focus by spirits and subjective information that you are unaware of. The communication within the whole of your consciousness is precise. It is extremely efficient, creative, and communicative.

You choose objectively. You may express to yourselves a lack of understanding as to your choices, but you choose consciously. What you seek to understand presently is the direction of probabilities which are influencing of your choices. This is the direction of the unofficial information. As you begin to look to all of the aspects of unofficial information that surround you continuously, you shall offer yourselves more information as to your own directions within your choices of probabilities.

Be remembering also; just as we have stated previously that within religions and philosophies there are bases of truths, one of these is, ’You shall always answer yourself. You shall always receive what you have asked for.’ Within religions, they express that if you are asking of god, he shall be offering to you. If you are asking, you shall receive an answer; but as you recognize already, you are the one that is answering you, and you shall answer yourself creatively and in a fashion that shall be instructive to you; for no other knows you and your attention and (pause) what will be instructive to you as well as you know yourself. You may view your own creations curiously at times, but you creatively utilize unofficial information to be presenting to yourselves efficient methods, within choices and action and events, to emphasize to yourself what you wish to know. Therefore, if you find yourself within a position of expressing that you experience confusion or lack of understanding or anxiety, you may also look to yourself and you may ask yourself how you have chosen to gain your own attention.

No cosmic entities are pulling strings upon you as puppets! You are your own directors within your own play, and you shall be directing efficiently for your attention. If you ask to widen and you seek this sincerely, you shall bombard yourself with your own belief systems to efficiently accomplish what you have asked of yourself. (I can certainly attest to the bombarding of belief systems, folks!) Therefore, your confusion may be addressed in looking to your own questioning of yourself, and examining of all of the unofficial information that you present yourself with continuously, for you do. As you move into confusion, you are more reluctant to be listening to your own unofficial information; but as I have expressed to you previously, if you are listening to the quietness and not allowing yourselves to be caught in the web of the drama, you may hear some of your answers. (Pause) We shall break, and I shall accept questions.

BREAK 7:16 PM RESUME 7:26 PM (Time was ten seconds)

ELIAS: You may inquire with your questions, if you are so disposed! (Grinning, and we all laugh, releasing some confused tension)

VICKI: I have a question about what you just said, about the direction of your probabilities influencing your choices. That was a little confusing. I don’t really understand.

ELIAS: As you enter a chosen physical focus, as we have expressed, you create a pool of probabilities. These are surrounding you continuously, that you may draw upon. All of these probabilities, as has been stated, are actualized. All events are simultaneous. Therefore, all probabilities, actualized simultaneously, are influencing of your choices. (Pause)

VICKI: Okay, I’ll chew on that one for a while ...

ELIAS: (Grinning) Our most difficult subject of simultaneous time! Time is a very tricky business! (Laughter) It is a very interesting creation, for it creates many different dimensions. It is a perception, but it also is a priori.

NORM: Supposedly, the fundamental unit of all that is, including and meaning everything, is the consciousness unit. I’m assuming that consciousness unit has no other parallel, that it is truly the one and only fundamental unit of all that is?

ELIAS: I prefer to express this concept as links of consciousness for units presupposes an enclosed system, and as there are no closed systems within consciousness, I have expressed to these individuals that it is more efficiently stated within links of consciousness; but yes, you are correct in your idea; this being the symphony.

NORM: The symphony? (Elias smiles at Norm) For example, the links of consciousness can be gestalts, or they can link together of course in any set. Some sets, for example, are electrons and atoms, neutrons, protons, electrons forming atoms, which are really tens of millions of these links? Is that a true statement?

ELIAS: Correct.

NORM: And they possess the ability to go in many directions at once as a unit?

ELIAS: They are everywhere simultaneously. They are not bound by dimension or space arrangement or perception or time dimensions.

NORM: Okay. You said that time is a thing, and also it is ... I should have perhaps stated that links or CU’s have the ability and the propensity of anything. They can be anything.

ELIAS: Correct.

NORM: Is time then, the thing time, is it really a link or a CU or a gestalt of those?

ELIAS: As I opened this evening’s session, I expressed to you all that you think in terms of things. You think in terms of atoms, molecules, electrons, photons. You think in terms of tangibles. Not all reality is tangible. As I express to you that time is a thing within itself, I do not mean this word thing as a tangible, physical element, although it is a thing in itself. It is a force. Now, Stephen, concentrate upon your equation; for time is a force pattern. (The equation is, ’Relay the force pattern as a source of tension’)

NORM: And it can provide a tension, and is the source of tension.

ELIAS: Just as you may look to your physical existence and you may recognize your force of gravity, you recognize this as a thing, but it is not composed of things. It is a force. (Intently) Time is a force pattern. It is a thing in itself holding the ability to be creative, and it may create variations on a theme of itself; but it is not composed of units.

NORM: Or links.

ELIAS: Everything, every thing, underline three times! is composed of links of consciousness, for there is no existence that is not consciousness! (My computer won’t underline three times!)

NORM: Thank you. (Here, Norm starts to get a funny, confused look on his face that remains throughout the session)

DREW: I have a question about choices because I’m a little bit confused by this. You said last week that physical focus and physical manifestations are symbols for essence activity. If that’s true, then how can we as symbols be making the choices for things that are taking place within our essence?

ELIAS: For you look to a symbol as only a representation of something. I have expressed to you that a symbol holds a quality of representation of something else, an interpretation, but it also is itself. It holds its own integrity. It holds its own reality. Therefore, you are a symbol, for your manifestation is a symbol of a focus of essence. As you look through your physical eyes and view different objects, they are a part of your reality, although they are also symbols to you; but they are, within themselves, their own reality. You also are a vision of essence, but you are a reality. Therefore, you also are a thing within itself.

DREW: Similar to the way a child may be a reflection of its parents, but yet it still makes its own decisions and its own choices in life? Is that a metaphor that works?

ELIAS: You may view in this manner, although this creates also deceiving ideas. I shall express to you that you, as has been stated, are a part of all, as all is a part of you, correct? Correct!

DREW: I won’t argue with you! (Laughter)

ELIAS: As you walk out of your dwelling and view a flower, this flower is not you, although it is a part of you. It also is a symbol to you. It is simultaneously a thing within itself, holding its own integrity and its own reality; to your way of thinking, separate and apart from you, although it is not separate and apart from you. In this manner you, as a focus of essence, are a viewed image symbol projection of essence, but you are a reality within yourself; holding your own integrity, creating your own reality, and making your own choices.

DREW: Okay. Then the other question I have is ... I’m almost afraid to ask this! At what level are the choices made? Because there are choices I’m sure I’m making that I’m not consciously aware of. And I’m wondering, is there a difference between conscious awareness and what we might call daily awareness? If it’s true that everything happens to us as a result of our choices, I would venture to guess that those who are murder victims and those who are in car accidents and those who have terminal illnesses, in their daily awareness, aren’t making those choices. Just as if I could tomorrow, or right now, in my daily awareness make a choice to change my reality ... The choices I make in my daily awareness are not reflected in my reality quite often.

ELIAS: Or so it appears! (Grinning)

DREW: I’m wondering at what level these choices are made, and how to access that level?

ELIAS: This is the reason that we discuss unofficial information presently, that you may more understand how you are creating your reality by witnessing and paying attention to all of your reality, not only what you are accustomed to paying attention to. I express to you that in reality, murder victims, murderers, accident victims, or any individual within any situation or circumstance, if you are truly viewing all of the information available to you, you shall see that you do indicate these probabilities. Just as you may, within quite objective obvious circumstances, view a pattern within yourself leading to a certain accomplishment, you also may view objectively, if you are noticing, indications incorporating unofficial information that shall express to you the direction that you have chosen within your attention, and the probabilities that you are leaning to be creating.

You also, as with the dream mission also, must be viewing creatively. Understand that you are creative beings. Therefore, an individual may choose a debilitating automobile accident, in your terms. This may occur quite surprisingly. In actuality, if you are noticing all of the information available within the reality of this individual, you shall see a ’leading to’ the drastic, dramatic creation for the reasons within the probabilities that this individual has chosen.

Case in point; Jaren. Within a study of behavior and probabilities and choices and interaction with other individuals, noticing unofficial information alongside of officially accepted information, you would view an individual creating a counterpart situation to the unexpressed desires of the father. Within this situation, you would also view this individual of Jaren creating a choice to engage this counterpart action temporarily, and not to be wishing to continue this throughout the entirety of the focus. Therefore signs, in your terms, are exhibited of not wishing to be continuing within this counterpart action. Also, on the part of the father signs are exhibited that the counterpart action is no longer necessary, for the value fulfillment has been accomplished. Therefore, within the confines of the relationship, the choice is made to turn the focus. The focus is turned drastically, in a discontinuation of counterpart action and also in a continuation of the individual focus in the direction of probabilities that this individual has chosen for their own focus. In this, the choice is made of a dramatic event; an automobile accident; creating a devastating, in your terms only, action and reaction within those individuals intimately physically surrounding this individual, breaking the tie of counterpart interaction, reestablishing the direction of probabilities which was initially chosen for the individual focus to continue, and allowing for fulfillment of the father in expressed experience.

Note: For more information about Jaren, refer to sessions and . If you don’t have these transcripts and want them, let me know. Jaren is certainly an interesting example. Vic I understand that this is complicated, but if you are viewing closely you will view certain behaviors, certain choices, certain actions that are indications to you, clues of your own direction. You need engage your periphery and be understanding that all of your reality that you create is not within one narrow line. You pull from many, many angles within your probabilities, and you also interact and intersect with alternate selves. Much more is going on within your reality than you view!

In this, as you look to how you are creating your reality, you must also take into account all of reality and all of its angles, for there are many. Each action that you choose may not in actuality be directly related to the action quite previous to it. It may appear that the action is following within a line of probabilities or within a line of events, but this is not always the case; although simultaneously it shall also fit into the scheme of present motion, but it may hold ramifications beyond the present circumstances.

You do not think to yourselves of the influences that are pressing to you continuously. You hold many focuses within essence. You hold many alternates within one focus. Your future self, as you think of it, is also quite influencing of your present. This is not to say, once again, that you hold no objective control and direction, for you hold all. You only do not look to your own action.

I express to you that the smallest, to your way of thinking, actions that you alter within a daily routine are precisely chosen. You may awaken one morning and you may be choosing to comb your hair differently. You may choose to eat your porridge before your coffee or tea, as opposed to your normal routine of sipping your tea or coffee first. These seem to be insignificant alterations, but these also are conscious choices and affect you; for you have chosen, within this particular day, a different routine. You have chosen to alter your methods, and within this you alter the whole of you. Your perception changes. You may not notice a dramatic alteration of perception, but your perception shall alter. This is a very slight, small example which offers a very slight, small alteration of your reality; but it is an example of how each choice is created, which alters your perception and also creates your existing reality.

(Intently) It is all objective choices. You are not walking through this physical reality asleep! You are not engaging other individuals or your employment within your dream state! You are awake. You are objective. You are thinking. You are choosing. Your choices are made objectively. You are directing.

BOB: Can I ask a question? Would you say that this is a trial and error process?

ELIAS: No. (Firmly)

BOB: Which would imply that you know the results of your choices prior to making them.

ELIAS: In one manner of speaking.

BOB: So if I choose to eat my porridge before I sip my coffee, I have some idea of what the implied change in my life is?

ELIAS: If you are allowing yourself to be noticing your periphery and noticing your reality. In one manner of speaking, yes; within essence you are aware, for all events are simultaneous. There is no future. There is no past. Therefore, you are aware of your action within its entirety. Within another respect you are not aware, for you choose to be singularly focused and you also choose not to listen and notice unofficial information.

BOB: But regardless, you make choices. So those who are more aware of their subjective activity or unofficial information, whatever, make choices in light of that, at least arguably, and those who are not make their choices ...

ELIAS: ... the same. (Grinning)

BOB: Okay. I guess that’s not what I would have said!

ELIAS: You choose differently, for you choose to be engaging the action of widening ... and you have asked!

BOB: So the only difference is awareness. You make the choices with a result clear on some level to you, but your awareness of the results or the choices ... You’re either aware of them or you’re not.

ELIAS: It is not necessary for your awareness. Many, many, many individuals engage physical focus, and do not hold an understanding of probabilities objectively, and move efficiently through their objective focuses. You have asked for this information. You have drawn yourselves to this information. You wish this information for your own widening, for the express reasoning of engaging the shift and engaging transition within physical focus.

BOB: Okay. Can I ask a separate question? Would you liken time to thought?

ELIAS: In a manner of speaking; for thought also is a reality and a thing in itself, although it also is a perception and a symbol. Therefore, yes; in a manner, it would be likened to thought.

BOB: Is thought a force in much the same way time is a force?

ELIAS: I would be defining thought as a motion. (Equation clue!)

BOB: Why???

ELIAS: It is a movement. Other elements within consciousness join with thought to be creating of reality, or of another reality. Time needs not join to be creating of reality, and it may be creating variations of itself.

BOB: On its own???

ELIAS: Yes.

BOB: I thought time was a creation of us, of essence, that it did not exist separate from us. (Here, Bob is audibly rubbing his face!)

ELIAS: Which it is, but you continue viewing singularly as things. Essence is consciousness.

BOB: Okay. Then time exists apart from consciousness.

ELIAS: Nothing exists apart from consciousness!

BOB: Okay. (Pause) Am I helping you, or are you helping me??? (Much laughter here, with Elias grinning to beat the band!)

DREW: If there was no physical reality, would there be time?

BOB: Too hypothetical.

DREW: Is that kind of what you’re asking, does it exist apart from physical reality?

BOB: No ...

DREW: Oh, it’s not. I’m sorry. Well, can you answer that question? If there was no physical reality, would there be time?

ELIAS: This is dependent upon the agreement and the desire of consciousness to be creating of this element.

DREW: But it’s possible.

ELIAS: Yes.

DREW: So it’s not dependent on physical reality.

ELIAS: No, although it is directly related to physical reality, for this is the area of consciousness that it is affecting of. Therefore, it is relative to physical focus.

DREW: I’m sorry Bob. I didn’t mean to ...

BOB: No, that was very helpful because I didn’t know how to ask the question! (Elias chuckles) So does time exist in ... I don’t want to say your reality. How do I phrase this? Well, when you’re not here, wherever you are, is there time?

ELIAS: (Grinning) Within the area of consciousness that I occupy, this time period that I engage you does not exist as time. It is not a sequence of moments.

BOB: Okay, but we’ve already accepted that time is not necessarily sequential and that it can be simultaneous, but that it still exists even though it’s not ...

ELIAS: Ah! We have accepted simultaneous time, have we? (Laughter)

BOB: Well, we have!

ELIAS: Ah! We shall be instructive to be offering a trophy to Simon for accepting simultaneous time, as the first human to be accepting of this reality! (We all lose it)

BOB: So I suspect the note of sarcasm that I hear would lead me to believe that acceptance in my terms is not quite the same as acceptance in your terms!

ELIAS: Quite! (Much laughter) You have accepted a concept. You have not accepted a reality! (Grinning)

VICKI: Actually, the term simultaneous time is rather contradictory in itself.

ELIAS: This is quite true, but you deal with a time framework. Shall I express to you, simultaneous nothing? (Laughter) You would not understand. Therefore, I express to you terms that you do understand. You involve yourselves within a reality that is within a time framework. All of your reality is intimately involved with time. There is no aspect of your reality that is not affected by time. Therefore, we deal with time within our discussions and our explanations; although I play with your terminology, as ’before the beginning’. (Grinning)

VICKI: So when you have like a precognitive dream, actually you’re viewing the event as it occurs.

ELIAS: Correct; which is occurring now. You are viewing sideways, not in front of. (Pause) I shall instruct to Lawrence, I shall engage you on the morrow for your questioning involving our new friends, singularly.

VICKI: I actually kind of already got that message.

ELIAS: Very good!

VICKI: Pretty good for me, huh? (Laughing)

ELIAS: Unofficial information accepted! Quite well done, Lawrence. We shall break again, and we shall continue ... briefly! (Grinning, and laughter) Although this also is relative!

VICKI: A matter of perception!

BREAK 8:18 PM RESUME 8:50 PM (Time was one second)

Note: There was much discussion during the break of counterpart action and agreements in general, and specifically about the action between Josh and his father. There was also discussion as to the meaning of the word love, and whether or not this is a belief system. Many religious beliefs flying around during this conversation!

ELIAS: One note to be adding to your present scenario with your discussion of counterpart action; the value fulfillment was fulfilled on the part of the father, not on the part of the son. The counterpart action was to complete a value fulfillment unexpressed within the father, which was accomplished.

NORM: Could you tell us what the value fulfillment was?

ELIAS: The son expressed within personality elements that the father felt unable to express objectively. Therefore, within action and personality the son accomplished, through his objective reality in young ages, accomplishments. This would be creatively and scholastically that the father was unable, or believed himself to be unable, to be expressing objectively. Therefore, the son expressed these qualities as a counterpart action, in accomplishing the value fulfillment for the father.

NORM: Within families, are there usually a lot of counterparts?

ELIAS: Many times there are counterpart actions occurring within family units.

DREW: Are we back open for questions? Is that what we’re doing? (Elias nods) A word came up here during the break that coincidentally I was thinking about during the week. It’s funny how that happens! Love. Is love just something that we perceive? Is love a real thing? It’s a feeling so it must be real, but with love we have all of these associations of love being good, and yet there is no good or bad. Can you define or explain or give us some understanding of the word and the feeling, and what love is? ELIAS: What you express within physical focus of love is an interpretation. Love is a reality. Love is a truth. This spans all dimensions, all areas of consciousness, all reality. Each dimension and physical focus holds its own individual interpretation of the action of love. Your interpretation of love within this dimension is a feeling. You also attach many, many, many belief systems to this concept. In actuality, love, being a truth, is dimensional; as color and tone. It holds many aspects of its own. You view this word as an emotion, a feeling, sometimes as an action. It is a dimensional quality of consciousness; a truth in itself. It holds its own integrity, as we have spoken earlier.

Within this dimension, you hold many interpretations and definitions of love. Within this dimension, you may experience an aspect of the reality of the action of this truth, although it is not frequently experienced; for in experiencing the true action of this reality and truth you must allow yourself, within your time framework, a momentary time devoid of belief systems and attachments, which may temporarily occur. This also is requiring of ultimate trustfulness. I express to you that you shall experience this only momentarily within physical focus, for this is the extent of the time framework that you shall hold the ability to hold the focus of the experience. Few individuals within physical focus experience this type of action. You, within your definitions, would explain this action within emotional terms, and express elation within its true form. Few individuals experience this.

But as to your questioning of its validity and its reality, yes. This is a truth. This is a reality. It is unbounded by dimension or area of consciousness. It is only interpreted and represented differently within different dimensions. Therefore, it is experienced differently; although as I have been explaining presently, if you are allowing yourself to be, within a moment, devoid of belief systems and open to the experience of the action of this truth, this also transcends dimensional elements; for each dimension shall experience the same action, achieving that particular moment in that event. Therefore, your interpretation of love is no matter, for within another dimension their interpretation of love may be quite different from your own, but their experience, given the proper allowance, shall be the same.

RON: So is hate a truth too? (Ron’s tweaking!)

ELIAS: No.

RETA: It is my understanding that you can bring more love into yourself, which will give you more energy, by concentrating on the heart chakra. Is there any special method, meditation, whatever, to bring more love so that you can receive more energy to give more love? Did I say that right?

ELIAS: In your questioning, you have asked effectively. I shall answer in that you are not limited in energy or in love. There is no limitation. You do not draw in more to yourself as portions, for it is not doled out to you in portions. It is; and there is no boundary or limitation. Truth is truth. It is unbounded. There is no limit to the availability or what you may view as your possession of, which in actuality you do not possess, you merely are; just as you may not draw in to yourself more color. It is; and its vibrational quality is within you. It is not a thing that you consume, and then exude outwardly. You merely are. Truths are.

RETA: Thank you.

ELIAS: You are welcome.

BOB: So love is a truth of essence? Love is a truth that is part of essence? It exists as a part of essence?

ELIAS: It is a truth, period.

BOB: Okay, and you defined it largely as an action.

ELIAS: Correct.

BOB: As we see it as a feeling, that’s somewhat of a mislabeling.

ELIAS: Not necessarily. This is your interpretation within this dimension within this physical creation, just as you interpret Source Events into physical actuality within mass events and individual events. These are realities also. They do not encompass the entirety of the Source Event, for it does not fit within the framework and confines of your physical reality; just as truths do not fit within the confines and framework of any physical reality, for they are boundless. All truths are dimensional, and action.

RON: Can I interrupt for a moment? I have to change the tape.

ELIAS: Very well. (Pause for tape change)

BOB: So in that love is largely an action while it’s also a truth, it’s something that you choose because action implies choice.

ELIAS: Does it?

BOB: To me it does! (Elias grins) Well, if we create our reality and that reality is making choices and all that we are is those choices, then doesn’t love exist within our reality as a choice?

ELIAS: You are placing this within confines. The entirety of your reality is not based upon your choices merely. (Pause) BOB: Okay ...

ELIAS: All of consciousness is action. (Longer pause)

BOB: And? (Pause) That’s all I get for now, huh? (Laughter)

ELIAS: (Smiling) You are limiting your thought process, boxing this concept into confines that you believe you may understand. Truths, in actuality, are beyond your complete understanding within an individual physical focus. Within essence, within the entirety of you, you hold the understanding; but within any given individual physical focus, the completeness of understanding of any truth is beyond your ability to comprehend.

All of consciousness is motion. All of consciousness is action. You are accustomed to viewing reality, as I have stated, as things. You individualize and objectify your reality, and you classify into things. This is how you perceive your reality. This works quite well within this given reality. This is not to say that it is the entirety of reality. It is not. Within consciousness, energy is not defined as things. Therefore, truths are not defined as things. It is difficult to convey to you, within the confines of your language, an adequate explanation.

I express to you that color is a truth. I am quite aware that within your thought processes, this registers as a thing. You may physically view what you think of as color, what you define as color. What you think of and what you define as color, within this dimension and physical focus, is an interpretation of a truth. It is, once again, a thing in itself, and it also is a symbol. You perceive the symbol. You view different colors that you attach words within your language to, such as red, pink, blue, green. You also attach vibrational qualities to these colors.

Within a greater reality, so to speak, color is an action and it is dimensional. Love is an action and it is dimensional. To your way of thinking, you may accept that color is dimensional, but you do not understand how it may be an action. To your way of thinking, you may accept that love is an action, but how may it be dimensional?

These seem to be inconsistencies, but outside of the singularity of physical attention, reality is quite expanded and unbounded. All of energy, all of consciousness, is motion. It is all a state of becoming. Therefore, so also are truths actions and states of becoming.

RON: Would it be fair to say that all emotions, like hate and joy and sorrow, are just objective interpretations or misinterpretations of the action that you just described as love? (Still tweaking!)

ELIAS: Not misinterpretations; but yes, interpretations relative to your physical focus. I have expressed to you recently that there are existences, dimensions, that do not incorporate emotion as do you. Their existence provides for value fulfillment equal to your own but within a different framework, for they have chosen a different experience. You have chosen a different experience. You have created many different dimensions for different physical expressions and experiences. Therefore, as you interpret emotion, this is relative to certain physical focuses. You are not the only physical focus that experiences and incorporates emotion, but all do not experience this creation. Therefore, when you express, ’Is hate a truth?’ No. This is an emotion which is relative to physical focus. This is a direct influence of belief systems. There is a difference between creations which have sprung from belief systems and truths which are interpreted through belief systems.

DREW: So that makes love a fundamental, unlike all of our other emotions, a fundamental action of what I will say is the universe, but of consciousness. It is a fundamental aspect of being, as opposed to any of the other emotions that we feel. The conversation we had during break was almost a question of its importance relative to being. You’re saying that love ... In the few weeks I’ve been here, you’ve used the word truth in relation to the things we’ve talked about very few times. If you’re using love and describing that as a truth, then that says to me that its importance in terms of being is fundamental in all dimensions.

ELIAS: Correct.

DREW: Well, that’s pretty important!

ELIAS: Correct.

DREW: I want to clarify a term. When you say love is dimensional and color is dimensional, does that mean multidimensional?

ELIAS: Correct.

BOB: However, if I understand what you’re saying when you say that love is a truth, that does not mean that our typical interpretations of love and descriptions of love are truth.

DREW: Right. Those are our interpretations, but it is a fundamental truth of being.

BOB: Right, which we have very little understanding of, if I heard correctly. So the characteristics that we impose upon love are not necessarily accurate. They’re not necessarily the picture. They are not the truth. The truth of love is something apart from the character that we give it.

ELIAS: This is not to diminish the reality of your interpretation!

BOB: Okay, but the point being that lots of people equate love and hate as sort of equal counterparts to one another Based on your definition, that would not be true because ...

ELIAS: Correct.

BOB: ... love is a truth and hate is an emotion filtered through belief systems. So love is not technically something that is filtered through belief systems, but our description of what we perceive to be love is filtered through belief systems, correct? So love is something truly apart from that, that we don’t particularly understand very well and that we take an awful lot of liberties describing, and whether some of those liberties are valid or not is a separate discussion. (Vicki loses it. I’ve been on this hamster wheel a few other times, Bob!)

ELIAS: You approach dangerous area! (Much laughter)

BOB: Seems like I’m on a roll tonight!

ELIAS: I take great issue with discounting of your creation, for you are quite accomplished and adept at discounting your creations and invalidating yourselves! Your creations are interpretations, but they are reality. They are not to be discounted. Your interpretation of a truth may be an interpretation in terms of consciousness non-physically focused within its entirety, but your interpretation of a truth within physical focus is reality. It also is not negative. It also is, is, creative!

BOB: Okay, but reality is not truth. (We all lose it)

ELIAS: (Grinning at Bob) Reality is truth!

BOB: So all experience and anything you create is truth!

ELIAS: In a manner of speaking.

BOB: Okay. If you create your reality and reality is truth, then you create truth! (Elias grins seductively at Bob, who backs off) Well, I’ll give that some thought! (I’d like to acknowledge Bob here for braving the hamster wheel!)

NORM: I have a question. I’m not sure that it would be worth considerable discussion, but I feel that the area of cooperativeness is probably quite important in my life. The relationship between cooperativeness and separateness or individuality, do you have any wise words in regard to that?

ELIAS: You shall present yourself, as you already are aware, with the opportunities to notice what you choose to address. With respect to cooperation and separateness, these are your choice, both; although as you choose to engage widening and as you ask yourself for information and helpfulness, you shall present yourself with the opportunity to view aspects of yourself that you may notice that are less efficient. Therefore, you shall create the opportunity for choices within probabilities of change, and you shall eventually open to recognize the direction within cooperation, as you learn to understand that there is no separation.

This is a very difficult issue for all of you, without exception; for you have created a physical focus that holds a camouflage of separateness. It is not an illusion, but it is a very effective camouflage of separateness. As you realize that there is no separateness, there are no sections, there are no oranges, (grinning) you shall allow yourself more of an understanding of cooperation.

Be reminding yourself objectively that you are a part of all and all is a part of you, regardless of your tastefulness for any aspect. You may view another individual or activity as distasteful, but they are elements of you. It matters not. You are not removed and separate from all. There are no walls between any of you. You only allow yourself a temporary viewing that appears to be sectioned; but although you create a physical manifestation, even this is not contained and sectioned from all else.

You shall find also, as you continue within your widening process, as many of my dear friends have continued with me within these session periods, that as you request of yourself your own widening you shall offer this to yourself, and you shall confuse yourself, and you shall shriek with dismay at times! But, you have requested. Just as we have spoken, you objectively choose. You are not the victim of a conspiracy within subjective movement. You have chosen, and you shall present yourself with those elements that you need be viewing for your own awareness and your own widening; this allowing you to more efficiently engage your shift, and transition within physical focus without senility!

VICKI: I’d like to ask a question about one of those elements. I had an interesting experience with unofficial information this week, within an objective presentation of a woman and then a dream presentation of the same woman, and a name and an alignment with a family. It was an unusual experience for me. I have several feelings about what it was an example of in several different areas, but I’m real foggy in some places too. I don’t understand what the emphasis on the Zuli family was all about. I can’t quite get any impressions on that. I’m not quite sure about my connection with this woman or if it’s even a connection with an individual, or if I’m totally misinterpreting the imagery. (

ELIAS: This is an effective example of unofficial information. We have been discussing this subject matter, and in this you shall begin to notice unofficial information and you shall present yourself with opportunities to view and recognize unofficial information. This recognition is not always a drawing to yourself of what you think of in your terms as profound information with very deep cosmic meanings! You are offering yourselves the opportunity to view objectively and recognize unofficial information. This, may I say at the ’tail end’ of your subjective adventure, was a presentation to you. Once again, a gift; an offering of unofficial information that you may objectively physically view; although I wager, in inquiry, individuals physically focused as yourself present at this occurrence have no recall of this apparition. (Smiling)

You have offered yourself verification within your dream state for your own understanding. This also is a connection of waking and dreaming realities, an objective awareness of the mergence of the two, that these are not in actuality separate focuses within your individual manifest focus. They are expressions, but altogether the same. Therefore, you offer yourself the example objectively and subjectively, in information that may be confirmed. Well done.

VICKI: Would the statements you just made also apply to Mary’s dream some time ago about somebody named Patience?

ELIAS: This being another similar activity. Yes, you are correct. As to the significance of the Zuli family, this is information, unofficial once again, which you are offering to yourself to be recognizing of this particular family; its interaction, its representative, which we have spoken of recently also within interaction of energy and your identification of the importance of this interaction, and also of this action of creation physically of the Zuli within the action of the shift, in a return to original intent, so to speak; in your terms, a creation of physical expression; the experimenters. You approach a new experiment within the shift. Therefore, this family shall be quite instrumental in the actualization.

VICKI: Thank you.

ELIAS: You are welcome.

BOB: Can I ask just a quick question in clarification of your discussion with Lawrence? Am I to understand that for the most part, her experience with this woman and the subsequent dream was not so much information that was being imparted to her, but just an example of the process through which information could be imparted so that she could see the process, as opposed to the actual information, and identify it? Is that what you said?

ELIAS: In part, yes.

BOB: Okay. That’s good enough. You don’t have to ...

ELIAS: Yes, you have interpreted correctly, partially. It is important, as you are widening, to be merging objective and subjective realities. This you may view as a process, although there are no processes, (grinning) for you shall move yourself into the awareness of this mergence gradually; this benefiting you each in avoidance of trauma, in not thrusting yourselves into the mergence of awareness and disorientation.

BOB: So would that explain to some extent the dream that I had the other night?

ELIAS: This is not a dream. This action is not dream imagery. This is a different action. This is similar information offered to you in unofficial information that you recall. You have recalled objectively an out-of-body experience. Simultaneously, William also engaged an out-of-body experience. Therefore you, in recognizing this momentarily, thought to be expressing to William, although William was not paying attention. You engaged your own activity within another direction. As you realized that you were not engaged within what you view to be a waking state, your response was instantaneous, in ’snapping back’ to physical expression.

BOB: Okay, I pretty much understood everything you said, except in the beginning you said that I was not in dream state.

ELIAS: Correct.

BOB: So, you’re saying I was awake. Because I initially thought I was awake.

ELIAS: No. You engaged your sleep state. Within this process, you chose to be engaging in an out-of-body experience, which you all experience and accomplish, underline this entirely, every sleep state! You do not recall all of your out-of-body experiences. You have offered yourself the opportunity to recall the activity that you engaged in this out-of-body experience.

BOB: So, while I was out-of-body I engaged unofficial information, recognized that I did, let myself experience it to some extent with some comfort, sought to engage her (Gail) in it unsuccessfully, and at some point realized that I was out-of-body but didn’t recognize it as that, chose to recognize it as being in a dream, and that snapped me back in body and awake simultaneously.

ELIAS: Correct.

DREW: How does that differ from a dream?

ELIAS: Dreams are imagery. They are an interpretation of subjective activity. You engage out-of-body, in your terms, activity continuously. Within every day of your physical existence, you experience out-of-body situations. You do not recall this action, for within your belief systems this is unnatural and frightening. And as we are all aware, you only disconnect from your physical body at the point of death! Therefore, be wary of out-of-body experiences! (Very humorously)

But to continue, within the experience of what you think of as out-of-body, you may recall portions of the action that you engage. You may choose to engage similar action to physical waking state; walking through hallways, looking at furniture, stepping outside of your doorway, viewing yourself within another physical location upon your planet. These are all actions that you may engage. They are not the entirety of the action that you do engage every time period within your sleep state, but your consciousness may choose physical activity temporarily. In this, you may recall, if you are allowing yourself, your activity during this state.

Within dream state, or what you term to be dream state, this is an imagery that you create for yourself which is an interpretation creatively of the action that you have engaged while in your sleep state. It has been stated many times to you that your sleep state is not engaged for physical restfulness. Your physical expression, your body, does not require sleep state. Your consciousness requires sleep state as you are engaged within physical focus, for this is your opportunity to be in communion with essence. This is your opportunity to exert your creativity to its maximum ability within physical focus; your engagement of Regional Area 2.

DREW: And the dream is the interpretation of those experiences.

ELIAS: Yes.

DREW: Was Ron’s experience then an actual physical manifestation in a different physical dimension? Is that what you’re saying? That his out-of-body experience was a manifestation in another physical dimension, as opposed to just imagery of a subjective experience in dream state? (I think Drew meant to say Bob, not Ron)

ELIAS: Not another dimension; (pause) another area of consciousness within this dimension.

DREW: Really. Within this physical dimension?

ELIAS: Correct.

DREW: He projected out-of-body into another area of consciousness in this physical dimension?

ELIAS: Correct.

DREW: I don’t understand that! (Laughter) Am I alone in this?

BOB: A dimension can be parallel, so it can even be the same proximity. It’s just not necessarily, in time, the same place. At least that’s how I understand it.

DREW: So when he recalls walking through hallways with rafters and glowing red and holes in the door and that kind of thing, that was an actual physical experience? (Referring to Bob’s OOBE in dream state)

ELIAS: Correct.

DREW: Not imagery.

ELIAS: Correct.

BOB: Now, a couple questions here. I tried to interact with Gail while in that out-of-body state. Could she have interacted with me, and would interaction be not unlike our activity in objective consciousness?

ELIAS: Yes, she could interact with you if choosing to do so, and if choosing to do so, this interaction would not be unlike the interaction that you experience within waking state.

BOB: So these out-of-body experiences, which I don’t believe I’ve had that often because this seemed somewhat ... (Here, Elias sits up straight and grins at everybody) I heard you say I have them all the time! I heard that! (Much laughter) But I have not experienced consciously having them in the same way that that I did the other night. I didn’t remember them.

VICKI: Recognition is an amazing thing!

RETA: Maybe he’ll get another trophy!

BOB: Now I’ve lost my train of thought! Are there interactions in that state with varieties of other essences? Are those common? Or generally, when you’re out-of-body you’re projecting by yourself in whatever dimension you’re in and there aren’t a lot of other out-of-body focuses to interact with at that point?

ELIAS: You are never by yourself! You may not be aware within your remembrance of interaction with other essences, but you are never engaged within an action alone!

BOB: Okay, I’ll just accept that for now. I think I’m probably the only human to ever accept that! (Much laughter, and somebody says, ’Another trophy!’) The other question I have is, since these out-of-body experiences happen regularly and commonly without remembrance, do they happen simultaneously with imagery and layers of imagery and we just access one thing at a time? Are they not necessarily all interconnected? For instance this experience, I’m out-of-body, I’m experiencing something, okay? And I’m actually interacting with it or remembering it. At the same time, am I experiencing dream state activity that I might have been remembering instead of this? Am I doing lots of things simultaneously within this dream state?

ELIAS: In actuality, yes.

BOB: Okay. So it’s kind of like picking which part of the disk I’m gonna access at any given point.

ELIAS: Presently, you may view it in this manner, for do not allow yourself the luxury of viewing all of your facets of yourself simultaneously.

BOB: But I could.

ELIAS: Yes.

BOB: Will I??? (We all crack up)

ELIAS: Yes.

BOB: Thank you!

VICKI: You might get another trophy!

BOB: I’m not gonna ask when ’cause that would be kind of like ... I’ll just accept yes!

ELIAS: Very good. I shall disengage for this evening and I shall be quite ready for your questioning at our next meeting, for I am quite encouraged, in your terms, that you are beginning to be questioning more. This is an indication of movement within our directed direction! (Chuckling) And I shall be engaging Lawrence for information of inquiries of new friends.

To you all very affectionately, au revoir!

Elias departs at 10:08 PM, and pops back in at 10:38 PM. Again, pop-ins usually begin mid-sentence, whenever somebody remembers to turns on the recording equipment. Here, Elias is directing to our conversation about probable selves, and specifically to Norm.

ELIAS: ... probable selves. The energy of a probable self is not absorbed by remaining probable selves. You are a probable self, as are all other selves. Each is a probable self to each other. Each is its own manifestation. Each holds its own reality. One is not reality, and all others imaginary. They are all reality. They are all independent, in a fashion. They are all individual creations. They are all energy, as you are energy. If you are a probable self, which you are, when you die, are you absorbed to the other probable selves?

NORM: Well, I think my interpretation was that there was energy available to the other probable self. Not that all of the energy of that focus went over to the other side, but that there was energy available for the other person, or maybe there was experience. I guess there was experience available to the other probable self.

ELIAS: All experience and all energy of all probable selves is available to all, but each is unique to themselves. Therefore, they continue within individual existence within their own value fulfillment; just as you are not absorbed back into the concept of essence as you disengage physical focus, for you are not separate. Therefore, you are not cast out and then absorbed back. You are the entirety. You are also unique and individual and a new creation, and continue.

Note: I find it interesting that to this point, which is about five minutes into the pop-in, everybody in the group coughed a lot, especially Norm. There’s something to notice here ...

NORM: In the probable worlds, and I’m assuming that worlds is truly plural there. For example, I had an event in my life when I was sixteen years old that I could have chosen to go one way or the other way. I was here in California as a sixteen year old, on my own, and I chose to, rather than stay in California, go back to my home and finish high school. Now to me, in reading about probable selves, I was thinking that was probably ... I had a decision to make. Would that have been a beginning of a probable self, or is my entire interpretation of probable selves not correct?

ELIAS: The probable selves exist. They are all within the energy of you. Their motion, in a counter-to-parallel direction of you, occurs at moments of choice.

NORM: Which occurs all the time, really.

ELIAS: Correct. They may follow your choice, or they may choose alternately. Each choice that you make affects all others, and each shall be influenced. Some shall actualize other choices. Some shall actualize the same choice with a different slant. I shall offer to you that an alternate self of you exists parallel to you with one less child than you ...

NORM: In the United States?

ELIAS: ... for within probabilities and probable selves, one daughter chose not to continue within physical focus. Therefore, within your reality, a daughter physically exists. Within a probable reality, this daughter does not.

NORM: So there are multiple camouflage systems where I exist simultaneously.

ELIAS: Correct.

NORM: But there has to be an infinity of these! (Now Norm’s rubbing his face!)

ELIAS: Correct. (Grinning, and we all crack up)

NORM: Beautiful! Do I have that many wives??? (Laughing)

VICKI: Can I ask a question about that? The energy and experience that is available from, say, a probable self, this is just as available whether or not somebody croaks, right?

ELIAS: Correct.

VICKI: It doesn’t make any difference.

ELIAS: No.

VICKI: One other question. As far as experiencing other focuses, it’s occurred to me that you do have the ability, temporarily, to experience the focus of another essence just as richly as you can experience a focus of your own essence. Is this correct?

ELIAS: Temporarily. There are no divisions within consciousness. You are not orange sections! (Grinning)

VICKI: I had this experience the other day and I thought it was unusual, because I think I was assuming that you would experience a focus of your own essence much more richly than that of another.

ELIAS: Consciousness is consciousness. It is all energy. The only distinguishment is its arrangement. (Pause)

NORM: Infinite, I mean infinite ... (And Norm loses it. Poor Norm! He had the strangest look on his face all evening!)

ELIAS: (Grinning) Also I shall offer, as to your equation, it is not so general. It is precise and immaculate. You have been offered a clue this evening as to your time element. (To Drew) And you may also be acknowledged that yes, clue.

DREW: About color?

ELIAS: Yes.

DREW: And also about sound and music. (Elias nods)

ELIAS: This indicates depth, and an inner realization and knowing of more than what you physically perceive; so you are correct.

DREW: Thank you.

ELIAS: You are welcome. (To Norm) Continue to investigate your equation! Think clearly of relay this force pattern. I have instructed you that this word of relay is instrumental.

NORM: Thank you.

ELIAS: You are welcome. As I have clarified for you this evening, I bid you all adieu, once again!

Elias departs at 10:51 PM.

FOOTNOTES:

(1) This experience involved seeing what appeared to be a very old woman at the bank. She didn’t seem to ’fit’ into the picture, and I was mesmerized by her. I stared at her for quite some time. A few nights later, I saw this same woman in a dream. She was presented as being aligned with the Zuli family, and I saw the name ’Mary Summer Rain’. I know now that this is an author, but I had never heard of her when I had the dream. A friend brought over some books by Mary. The sketch of the old Indian woman who was her ’teacher’ is an exact replica of the woman in the bank and in my dream. This woman is deceased. I thought this was interesting in that I had the objective viewing first, and then the dream imagery. Usually I receive dream information first, and consider it a ’precognitive dream’. This was backwards! (Of course, I do lots of things backwards!) Vic

A final note: To all of you who are wondering why I finally chose to include the copyright symbol on the transcripts, it’s because I finally figured out how to do it! This computer stuff comes slowly, but it comes!

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Copyright 1997 Mary Ennis, All Rights Reserved.