Choices After Removal of a Brain Tumor
“Choices After Removal of a Brain Tumor”
“Information and Intuition”
“It’s Harder to Undo Something Than to Prevent It”
“You Are the One That Is Directing”
“Some Types of Trauma Don’t Go Away”
“Use Your Arsenal”
Thursday, February 16, 2023 (Private/Phone)
Participants: Mary (Michael) and Anon
ELIAS: Good morning!
ANON: Good morning.
ELIAS: (Chuckles) And how shall we proceed?
ANON: Well, I was kind of laughing to myself because I was thinking about our last session where, you know, the news of everything that had happened to me and my whole experience with the brain stuff was still relatively new. So I was still sort of taking it in, and I was all kind of optimistic. (Laughs) I was all like cool breeze, it’s okay, I understand, it’s all good, I’m manifesting this all for a reason. And then I had time to let fear sink in. (Laughs)
ANON: And it’s been an interesting… And looking… And I’ve had a lot more experiences with the medical establishment since then, and it’s all been very interesting because I’m learning more about myself. And so, I’ll just dive in with what’s happening.
So there’s a couple of really cool things that have happened, and then there’s a couple of things that have been very… I have had to really work through in a much more complex level. But one of the things that happened was I went and saw an oncologist.
ELIAS: Very well.
ANON: After I saw my neurosurgeon. And the oncologist is basically in charge. He’s the point person of my treatment going forward. And so whatever kind of treatment I decide to have, he will be the one that all the information will come back to, and he’ll be kind of helping me coordinate and kind of checking in with me. So I’ve never met this man before, and I went with my best friend to see him. And he basically was like giving me… it was like information from a fire hose. It was like he was giving me so much information. When I went to see him, like I said last time, I was under the impression that all they were going to recommend was radiation treatment. But when I saw him, he was like, “Well, we think, oncologists think the best way to go is a radiation-chemo combo.” And that kind of took me aback.
And he said, “And you know, the thing in your case is you have a low-grade glioma, which doesn’t have as much…” I mean, he was very transparent. He was like, “This doesn’t have as much research as like things that are more life-threatening.” And he said, “You know, if you were younger, we would probably say don’t do anything, but because you’re 58, we… Typically as people get older, we like to be more aggressive in our treatment.” And he said, “You know…”
I mean the big, the big… Well, the potential for them is that it could grow back. And if it grows back, it could grow back and become malignant. And so what they, their aggression comes from the fact that they don’t want it to grow back. But he kept saying, “You know, we don’t have a ton of research to support it. The most research we have is that the one-two combo of radiation and chemo does the most good.” And then he was like telling me about the two types of chemo, which is one is Temodal and has less side effects, which is called TMZ. And then there’s the three-cocktail mix, which is called PCV, and that has a lot of side effects. And then he’s like, “Well, the one that is less invasive, we don’t have a lot of research on that.”
And then he goes into the radiation, which I was more open to because I’m not open to chemotherapy. He’s like, “Well, there’s photon or there’s proton, and proton is newer and there’s not much research on it, but that targets the area much more specifically.” The photon can go past the target and damage cells around the area, but sometimes that’s good because it can get the rogue cells.”
So this is all coming at me. And he’s like, “And you know, it would be five days a week, five times a week, with either therapy.” And I’m listening to him, and then I’m like, “But what if it damages cells, and this is my brain?” and I go, “What area is being affected?” And he goes, “Well, it’s your executive functioning.” (Laughs) And I’m like, “Okay, that doesn’t sound good.” (Laughs) And he says, “You know, a lot of times the brain will… You know, some areas will jump in and take over what has been damaged.” And I’m like, “Okay, I know that.”
And so all of this was kind of new information. And then I went home and I looked online a bit about brain radiation, and I saw that there can be cognitive decline in later years sometimes from radiation. Not immediately, but it can happen later. And there can be issues around, like he was telling me, “You might have issues around about multi-tasking, or your motivation, or you might speak slower.” And I’m like, “Man, all of this does not sound good.” So this is all coming at me, and he’s like, “You don’t have to make – Obviously, do not make this decision now. You could do nothing. You could do just radiation. You could do just chemotherapy. You could do both.” But I have an appointment with a radiation oncologist next week, to talk about everything more. And so, I was just letting this all sit.
ELIAS: And have you thought about what questions you would have for this physician?
ANON: Yeah. I mean, I think, I think the main questions are around “In your history as a doctor, how much damage…” because this guy that I’m being sent to is more brain specific, so he deals more with brains than other parts of the body. So I would say to him, you know, “How much damage do you typically see happen? Do you see these secondary… secondary damage happening to people often? Do you see cognitive decline happen? Or is this worst-case scenario? And is photon therapy, which is far more readily available than proton therapy in Chicago, is this something that you would recommend over proton therapy?” You know in my case, one thing the doctors have kept saying is I’m kind of on the line. Even though I’m 58, that isn’t super old in their estimation. And also, since the beginning, everyone’s like, “Oh my god, you’ve had such a good response after this surgery, like you’re almost back to normal, and that’s amazing.” Everyone keeps saying that. And so people have said this is a really good sign, of just like your overall health.
And I did ask the oncologist, I said, “So if I… If the potential, if it does grow back, could I then do radiation or chemo?” And he’s like, “No, you would just have another surgery.” Which of course brings its own risk.
So those are the questions I would ask the radiologist or the radiation oncologist.
ELIAS: Very well.
ANON: I mean, does that make sense to you?
ELIAS: Most definitely. I would say that those are very comprehensive questions, yes.
ELIAS: And that’s (pause)… I would say that is a very good beginning for gathering information. And in that, the more information you have, the more you can generate an informed choice and decision.
Now; in addition to all of that, what is your intuition telling you?
ANON: Well, this is a very interesting thing. If you had asked me that two days ago, even after the oncologist, I would have said radiation. But the more information I gathered, the more it sank in, I began feeling frightened by this option. And then I was talking to my ex-husband, who I feel has a fair amount of intuitive abilities, and he just had this knee-jerk reaction of like, “Don’t do anything. Don’t do anything.” And there was something about him saying that to me. At first I was like oh, he’s just having a fear response, but then I was like yeah, doing nothing is an option. I think it was the first time I really took in, that is a choice. That is a bona fide choice.
ELIAS: Yes, it is.
ANON: And I was saying to Mary, what I’m getting clear on… Like Hazra said something in our meeting. She was like, “Do you feel you don’t have… Do you not trust yourself enough to not manifest this again?” And what I realized later… Like in that moment, I’m like, “I trust the medical establishment. I don’t trust myself enough to go forward without medical help at this point.” But then later, I realized when I was talking to Mary, it’s more like say if I had a growth in my head right now, I don’t trust myself to de-manifest it, but I’m beginning to trust myself more to not manifest it again. And I don’t know if that, if that makes (laughs) any sense whatsoever.
ELIAS: It very, very much does. Because for everyone, it’s harder to undo something than to prevent it.
ANON: Wow! Really?
ELIAS: This is not unique to you. This is something that I have expressed to many individuals in relation to situations that they may be creating. It is much easier to move in a direction of preventing something from happening than it is to undo it, once it’s already been created.
Therefore what you’re expressing, yes, makes very much sense, in your terms. It is very reasonable and very realistic that moving in a direction of not creating another scenario such as this, not moving in the direction of creating another manifestation or another growth, is much easier than creating it and then having to address to it again. Because I would say (pause) it would be more difficult, if you did it again. If you created that again, you would have to engage surgery again and if you had to engage a second surgery, you likely wouldn’t come out of it as you have now. (Pause) In a manner of speaking, if you moved in that direction, that would be definitely playing with fire.
ANON: See, this is—
ELIAS: But you’re not moving in that direction. Therefore, it’s actually a moot point. (Inaudible)
ANON: Well, you see – yeah, okay. Right. Keep going. Keep going.
ELIAS: You’re not moving in that direction to begin with. Therefore, in a manner of speaking, it doesn’t matter. That that’s all speculation of what might happen if you were moving in that direction, but you’re not. That manifestation was specific. You had been creating that for a considerable time framework, many years. And in the past two years, I would say most intensely, you’ve been addressing to the reasons that that was manifest, seriously. And you have generated some significant and intense movement, to the point that you matched your forward movement in intensity with the intensity of the past experiences. (Pause)
ANON: When you say that, what do you mean? (Pause) Like what was the forward movement?
ELIAS: Experiences in relation to your traumas have been intense.
ELIAS: And your movement in addressing that and moving forward and becoming more self-aware and empowering yourself, you have matched in intensity. You have become just as intense and fierce in your quest and your determination to be moving forward and to be healing and to be empowering yourself, as the intensity of the trauma experiences themselves.
And in that regard, what I would say to you, my friend, is you’re done. (Pause) You accomplished. You did it. You’re done. And removing that manifestation is your physical, objective evidence of being done. The last part of it, you cut out. (Pause)
ELIAS: It’s gone. (Pause) Therefore, what I would say to you is, whatever you choose to do, don’t take on any weight with it, because you let go of the weight. Therefore, whatever you choose to do, know that that choice is simply your assurance to yourself that you’re done. (Pause)
And sometimes people, in a manner of speaking, need to give themself some assurance that something is done and that is entirely acceptable.
ANON: So – and I know you’re not pushing me in one direction or another, but you know, my biggest concern is a wholesale change in behavior or you know, mental capacity or something that is going to significantly impair me. And while I know the radiation oncologist can answer those questions, I will also put it to you. While I understand exactly what you just said, that sometimes people need assurances and certainly doing some sort of treatment is that assurance, to put it to rest, but in your estimation as a probability, do you see that as a significant probability if I were to engage radiation?
ELIAS: Before I answer that, let me express this. Whatever you choose, it’s not black and white. That whatever you choose, you can also change your mind. Therefore if you choose not to, you could change your mind to move in the direction of doing it. If you choose to do it, you can also choose to stop. YOU are the one that is directing, not the doctors, not the technicians, you. You are the one that is directing. I know that in these situations, it seems that the physicians are in the director’s seat, but they’re not. They want to be. I would say especially oncologists. Oncologists, oh, oncologists, oncologists. They are very similar to psychologists and psychiatrists. They believe that they are always right and that they have the answers and that they know what is best for you. Keep that in mind, because they’re also generally speaking – and this is not to say that all of them are moving in this direction, but most of them do – is that they move in a direction of being considerably pushy, similar to a psychologist. Because they believe they’re right.
But what I would say to you is, you always have choices. You are the director. Therefore you can choose and then you can change your choice. Nothing is black and white.
Now; that being said (sighs), I would say, is there a chance in your terms or capacity that it would have an effect on your cognitive ability? Yes. Would it be significant? That depends. That depends on the intensity of the radiology therapy and the length of it. I would say that it could be anything in the range of slowing your thought process, and in slowing your thought process it might take the form of that at times it might require a second or two extra for you to find a word or for you to put an idea together. Is it likely to generate something more dramatic? Depending on the intensity of it, it could. It’s less likely. I would say that mmm, it might become somewhat annoying, but if you understand what has created that, then it won’t be frightening. It could be frightening if you didn’t understand, but if you do understand and you do have information, it, even if you moved in a direction of expressing some intensity with radiology, it’s still likely that what it would actually affect is not your ability to be engaging cognitive thought and reasoning, but that it would slow it down. Which that could actually be a benefit.
ELIAS: Or it could be annoying. But even if it’s annoying, it’s not something that would be tremendously affecting. You won’t be engaging dementia or (inaudible)—
ANON: (Laughs) You read my mind. (Laughs)
ELIAS: That’s not going to happen. I would say that would, that might happen if you were moving in the direction of creating another mass, but you’re not. Therefore I would say that no, I would say for the most part it could initially disrupt your thinking ability, but I would also say that contrary to what the physicians believe, your brain actually does regenerate. I know they believe that it does not and that once you kill brain cells, they are dead forever. That’s actually incorrect and not true. Your brain actually has just as much ability to regenerate as any other aspect of your body consciousness.
Now; it may reroute some of its firing for a time, but that’s not necessarily tremendous. And I would say that at this point in your life, you have already generated a significant amount of exercising of your physical brain. You’ve already moved in a direction of creating more folds, more grooves. You’ve already moved in a direction of using more of a percentage of your actual, physical brain. Therefore in that, because of all of that, I would say that the effects would be much less.
ANON: Is that why I bounced back so much more quickly and they were kind of astounded?
ELIAS: Most definitely. Most definitely. Yes. Because you’ve already done all of this work. You’ve already created all of these new neurological pathways, all of these new grooves. You’ve already done this trauma work in moving the memories to the other side of your physical brain, connecting the feeling and the memory. You’ve done so much already, and doing all of your work with your tuning forks. In that, because you’ve done so much already with your actual, physical brain – which is not where thought originates, I repeat, but the action of thought does engage your physical brain. And in that, I would say that in being the command center of your body, it is a significant organ in your body. But I would also say that because of all of the work that you have already done, yes, not only is your recovery what the physicians would think of as being astounding. I would say it’s understandable that with everything that you have engaged, it would have been astounding if you wouldn’t be healing this quickly.
And in that, I would say also that in your direction and continuing to move in your direction and continuing to engage in the directions and activities that are important to you, that will also counter the radiation.
ELIAS: That can be countered. It can be countered.
ANON: Okay, so what I just heard you say is all of the effects of the radiation can be countered.
ANON: I mean one of the things that came to me, because I’ve started doing the inner landscape – inner landscape I’m trying to hit once a day. I would love to do it twice a day, so that’s my goal. But it came to me I think yesterday, because you know they always say, “Oh, you’re going to be exhausted during radiation.” That’s what this narrative is like, you’re always going to be exhausted. And I suddenly realized oh, well if I do inner landscape, I bet that would offset fatigue. And it’s—
ELIAS: It can.
ANON: It’s really interesting to hear you say that ALL of the effects can be offset.
ANON: So let me ask you this. So I kind of like this idea of moving… Let’s talk about the idea of moving forward without radiation. And I understood as I listened to the session, the last session, that as I continue to take action with what is important to me and really continuing to put myself primary, staying in flow, with all of these various things, trusting myself, and understanding that this is kind of the final movement of the resolution, right? I had this day when I did the show, I did my live show, and you know it feels right now that I’m in the space where everything I do professionally feels like an experiment, like I’m going to experiment with this to see how it feels, and like now that I have this additional knowledge, what do I want to do? So I put my show together and I brought on extra people that I trusted as helpers in one form or another, and then I brought on, as we had talked about, a co-host. So the show itself, I was really, really pleased with. And I really paced myself and I went backstage in the second half, allowed the other people to take over, which was a little scary, you know, letting other people take over (laughs) but I did it. And I was like, “Hey this isn’t that bad. They’re doing a good job!” And I came to a lot of conclusions, like “Hey I really like this other, this co-host. She’s doing a really good job.” Okay so that was all fine.
But during the day, I found myself engaging in the behavior that felt habitual and coming from trauma, of like pressuring myself and oh my god and the fear and I’m not getting this done and like the hustle and… And I got scared, because I’m like shit! This is like part of the old creation. This is that energy. And then I was like okay, number one, you’re aware of it, you’re seeing it for what it is. But like all sources, (inaudible) technical problems, and I’m like, “This is your energy. This is the reflection back of your energy. Your computer’s messing up. This thing’s messing up. Other things are being problematic.” And I’m like, “Okay.” But what I’m getting to, Elias, is when I come to this idea of not, I’m not going to manifest this again, this growth, I get afraid when I go through moments like that of like, “Have I really moved through it?” (Laughs) I understand things take a while to undo.
ELIAS: No, no, no, no. Now stop! Now. Now. (Pause)
There are different pieces of this. One is some trauma, some types of trauma, don’t go away. (Pause) You acquire tools and you learn to manage them. And that’s what your tools are for: to manage the trauma. Meaning that you acquire tools that you have as your arsenal, and when certain behaviors appear or when certain feelings, let us say, are presented, generally speaking fear or anxiety, that you recognize – which you did – as being associated with a trauma.
Because there are different traumas and they have different influences. Some of them you can address to and you can actually, in a manner of speaking, lay them to rest. And what happens then is occasionally something might happen in your life that touches one of those memories that it’s not a bother. You see it. It doesn’t actually bother you. You notice it, but then it’s gone. And you don’t actually have any reaction to it.
Then there are other traumas that yes, you’ve addressed to them and what you do is you partially move them, which is the part that you address to. But there are some traumas, these types of traumas, that they don’t go away. And what that means is that when certain things happen in your life, those memories can get touched and you do have a reaction, and you have certain behaviors associated with the reaction. And in that, what is empowering to know is that those traumas don’t go away and those traumas, you know how to manage. That you can go through your tools, go through your arsenal and find which tool is appropriate in a particular moment with a particular behavior, or with a particular experience, and what will be successful.
In that, the reason that this is important is that it empowers you. It lets you know that it’s not about there are sneaky things lurking that will sabotage you, but rather that you know that you are directing and that you are empowered and are continuing to empower yourself, and that for those experiences that you’ve had in your life that your physical brain has moved in a direction to protect you from in order that you don’t fracture, with those particular traumas, you know how to manage them. And that’s part of your empowerment also.
Therefore you don’t have to be afraid and worry that you’ll move in a direction of sabotaging yourself by recreating this manifestation in your brain. As I said, that was something that was directly associated with your trauma and YEARS of building, YEARS of not addressing, and then YEARS of addressing to, to get to the point of being done. Which you did.
Therefore sometimes you will see in yourself certain behaviors. You will see certain reactions, but you see them and you know what they are. And then you go to your arsenal. Do you understand?
ANON: I do.
ELIAS: And what are your tools?
ANON: Well, they are meditating.
ELIAS: That’s an excellent tool, yes.
ANON: Inner landscape.
ANON: Asking for essence support directly.
ANON: Stopping what I’m doing, doing something different. Going outside for a walk.
ANON: Sometimes merely looking in the quote generator on the Elias website for insight, just like a different way of thinking about something.
ELIAS: Very well.
ANON: That’s helpful. Breathing. So taking a moment and centering and just breathing more slowly. I don’t do this quite as much, but it’s certainly efficient (laughs) to bring my attention back to my body.
ANON: Engaging with Sigourn.
ELIAS: When you engage with Sigourn, how do you do that?
ANON: Sometimes I will just pet her and kind of connect with energetically. And the walking outside a lot of times is walking with her. So that’s… There is that. Sometimes I’ll use a sigil.
ELIAS: Although when you are connecting with Sigourn, you can talk to her. She will listen. It doesn’t matter whether she understands the actual words that you are speaking. She’s definitely tuned into your energy and she listens.
ELIAS: That is important, because sometimes when you are distressed or anxious or reacting and something has been touched, it can be very helpful to talk out loud but not simply to yourself. And in that, you can talk to her and she will listen, and that is actually more powerful than you realize.
But continue. What do you do in a moment, such as what you were describing, that you noticed that you were reacting and you noticed a behavior that you were expressing. What do you do in a moment such as that? You’re not at home. You can’t necessarily isolate yourself and go meditate.
ANON: Well if the show is coming together, I am at home you know, like I’m producing from my home. So what I do sometimes is I just say out loud. And you know, you talking to Sigourn, you telling me to talk to Sigourn is a great idea because sometimes I’ll just simply open my mouth and like kind of talk out what my concern is. Like, “I’m afraid.” You know, it’s a thing like Jason talked to you a lot about, of I will identify what is the uncomfortable thing, like “I’m afraid that I am not going to get finished in time for the show.” So once I identify that, I’ll just sit with it – and I do this a lot. I’ll just sit with it and be like, “Okay, I am afraid I’m not going to have things done by the time the show starts.” And then I’ll just be with it.
ELIAS: What I was expressing is, in times that you are, let us say, involved with the other people or you are at the place of the show.
ANON: Mm. Mm-hm. What do I do?
ANON: I usually will engage in noticing my breathing.
ELIAS: Very good.
ANON: That’s probably the easiest thing to do, because it’s not necessarily invisible but it’s something very easy. Or if there’s a friend nearby or someone I trust, I will actually say out loud what my issue is.
ANON: Like, “Wow, things are really starting to feel very overwhelming.” (Laughs) You know. Or whatever.
ELIAS: That’s excellent.
ELIAS: Very well. Then in this, you know what your tools are. You know how to use them. Therefore I would say you are managing quite well. And in that, you’re continuing to engage in a capacity that is what brought you to the position of being done. (Pause)
ANON: Okay. I’ve got to say something. Something’s coming up in the session, and I just have to say this out loud.
ELIAS: Very well.
ANON: I’m having this impression, like wow, this would be really cool (laughs) if I didn’t address to, if I didn’t employ radiation. Like what a testament to my, to trust in myself, if I… It feels like an adventure, like there’s something that feels very adventurous about going this route without radiation. I’m like… (Laughs) Is that crazy? Like it’s not like… I don’t know. It feels like… I keep using the word high wire. It feels like wow, this is like… This is like the ultimate in self trust. But I’m not really sure if that is… I’m kind of mistrusting this adventurous feeling.
ELIAS: I understand, and that is one of the reasons that I expressed to you that you can always change your mind. You can always change your choice. That if you choose not to move in that direction, you can be bold and you can be adventurous and you can experiment, and if you reach a point in which you suddenly become afraid and you don’t want to move in that direction any longer, you can change your mind. Nothing is set in stone, and nothing is absolute. And YOU are directing. You’re the one that’s driving the vehicle, and the vehicle is your body and you’re driving it. Therefore regardless of what the physicians tell you, they’re only suggestions. And in that, you are the one that decides what direction you’re going to drive your body in. And in that, when you decide to turn right and then you look at the landscape and you don’t like it, you can turn around and turn left. (Pause) Or you can keep going and you can change the landscape. (Laughs)
ANON: Mm-hm. (Pause) Whoo!
ELIAS: It’s all your choice.
ANON: Wow. And I found it so interesting that like actually even though the oncologist was shooting information at me, he… he was pretty clear that it was my choice.
ANON: I mean, he was being very, you know, obviously well-learned and all of that stuff, but I was kind of surprised at how much he was willing to share how little they knew, and that it was really up to me.
ELIAS: Excellent. Excellent. That is excellent, because they do have a tendency to be somewhat pushy.
ANON: Mm-hm. I mean, he kept reiterating he wanted me to take part in the study where I would basically be giving up my choices around what type of radiation treatment I had, and I’m like, “Oh, so you’d pay for this study?” “No.” And I’m like, “Would you pay for transportation?” “No.” (Laughs) Like, “Okay, so you’re just looking for bodies to give up all autonomy to be a part of it.” (Laughs)
ELIAS: Correct. And in that, it sounds very attractive, doesn’t it? (Both laugh) I would say that most people would jump at the chance to engage with that kind of a choice (Anon laughs) because most people are so selfless that they would do this for the greater good of the population in general. NOT. (Laughs)
ANON: Right. (Pause) So I do want to say that I’ve moved in a direction that feels unlike me, that I think is very positive, where I actually went on… Like friends put together this thing called Meal Train for me, that is like people can bring you food and they can also contribute funds, and people, friends of mine, were doing that. And that was amazing and I was so touched. And I was touched about the amount of help my friends have given me in general, but then I made the decision to make an announcement on Facebook and social media, and then also put in links to if people wanted to give money. And that felt so out there for me, (Elias laughs) like really out there. But I realized, and I talked about this on the show, I realized I actually had made a conscious decision to receive. Which was—
ANON: — different, and just like “I’m going to do this.”
ELIAS: That is tremendous.
(The timer for the end of the session rings)
ELIAS: That is quite an accomplishment.
ANON: Yeah. There have been definitely some really cool things happening. Like yesterday, I actually for about, I don’t know, anywhere from half an hour to an hour, I felt no fear. And I actually forgot that this thing had just happened to me, that I had just gone through this thing with the insurance company where like my medical bills are really big, and I just totally forgot everything. (Elias laughs) And I was like wow, this is really nice, not living in fear.
ELIAS: (Laughs) Remember that and hold onto it.
ANON: Right. Right.
ELIAS: That is significant.
ANON: It felt significant. It felt like I was moving in a new direction, really.
ELIAS: That IS, and that is tremendous. And I would say to you, my friend, that is also directly associated with being done.
ANON: Mm. (Pause) Hm.
ELIAS: That nothing can hold onto you any longer.
ELIAS: That nothing can confine you. Nothing can trap you. Nothing can cage you any longer.
ANON: Hm. (Pause) That’s powerful.
ELIAS: I very much agree. It very much is.
ANON: Yeah. (Pause) Thank you.
ELIAS: You are tremendously welcome. I would say what you have accomplished is tremendous. It is astounding, and it is at this point, sublime. (Both laugh)
ANON: Hm. (Pause) I appreciate the session.
ELIAS: I appreciate you.
ANON: Thank you.
ELIAS: (Laughs) I shall be anticipating our next conversation, and I shall be expressing tremendous energy with you in support and comfort, but also in power.
ANON: Hm. Thank you.
ELIAS: I shall make you an agreement that I will match the power that you express.
ANON: Mm! (Elias laughs) Very well.
ELIAS: Excellent. I know you can rise to the challenge.
ANON: (Laughs) I certainly can. (Both laugh)
ELIAS: Excellent. (Laughs) I express tremendous love to you, my dear friend, and shall very much be looking forward to our next conversation. In great friendship, as always, au revoir.
ANON: Au revoir.
(Elias departs after 1 hour 2 minutes)
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