Diet, Pressure, Exercise and Balance
Topics:
“Diet, Pressure, Exercise and Balance”
“Childhood Trauma from Witnessing Abuse”
Tuesday, April 20, 2021 (Private/Phone)
Participants: Mary (Michael) and John O. (Arry)
ELIAS: Good morning!
JOHN: Good morning.
ELIAS: And what shall we discuss, my friend?
JOHN: Hm. This is going to be interesting. I’m not quite sure yet where this is going to go, but I’ve got some hopefully simple things to start with.
I want to talk about diet first. For a long time I have played with diet and explored diet and tried different diets. In terms of eating patterns I’ve been vegan, I’ve been keto, I’ve been pretty much everything under the sun. And lately I’ve been feeling really frustrated, and I don’t know, I just kind of felt like I reached a point where all right, I’m ready to ask Elias about this because I can’t quite figure it out on my own, or I don’t really have a clear answer.
So, the main thing that I’m curious about is my digestion. And I’ve essentially had some kind of mild diarrhea-like symptoms for probably over a decade at this point, and the only time they’ve consistently stopped is when I was specifically eating keto, which is, as you know, very high fat, very low carb. And that really changed my digestion a lot and I didn’t have diarrhea at all, and I felt like my digestion was actually really good at that point. But yeah, I’ve not been doing that anymore. I basically eat everything. So, I kind of just want to know what would be the best type of eating style for me and my digestion, and really is it even about my diet and what I’m eating, or is it other things? Because I think that it also could very well be stress or something deeper, so to speak (laughs), and it’s not really about the food anyway.
ELIAS: I would say both. I would say that it partially is about food and it partially is about… you could label it stress; I would say that it is more pressure. And what I would say to you in that is in pressuring yourself, in generating a significant amount of pressure with yourself, that that is definitely affecting. What I would also say to you is that—as you likely are already aware—your digestive system is one of the most sensitive systems in your body consciousness. And in that, being so sensitive and delicate it is significant that you pay attention to balance, because your digestive system also, in a manner of speaking, regulates the entire rest of your body. Everything, every other system in your body, is very intertwined with your digestive system; therefore, when that is not functioning properly, it is affecting of other systems in your body consciousness.
Now, what I would also say to you is, when you generate manifestations such as loose stools for extensive time frameworks, that is definitely a signal of actually more than stress. And in that, it can be considerably affecting because eventually, that can lead to physical manifestations with your digestive system that develop into conditions or dis-eases, and that is something that you likely don’t want to create.
I would say that in relation to diet, it is simply a matter of paying attention to what you are consuming—meaning, I would say that moving in a direction of considerably high fat and very low carbohydrates is not necessarily significantly beneficial. I understand that you may have seen a significant change and that would be something that would likely validate to you that you were doing something good or right, but what I would say is, that is simply a reaction of the body consciousness in relation to incorporating less fiber, and in that, less fiber in a capacity that is in a balanced expression. And in that, it would likely create the type of response that you noticed, but that doesn’t necessarily mean that that is good.
JOHN: Right. Is there—
ELIAS: But I would— Continue.
JOHN: Go ahead.
ELIAS: I would express that the main element with this is pressure: you pressuring yourself in directions. And I would say it isn’t simply now; I am expressing that this has been an ongoing expression and situation with you for a significant amount of time. It simply changes in what you pressure yourself about, but that this is something that is very familiar to you, is moving in directions in which you ARE pressuring yourself in relation to what you do, how you do it, where you do it, why you do it (John laughs)—all of it. And therefore, in that, it creates these situations in which your body consciousness then is reacting in this type of manifestation.
I would say that it is something that is so familiar to you that you actually move in directions and expressions of generating that even in relation to what you do for fun. You choose activities that will include pressure, because it is so familiar to you, so automatic to you.
Now, that doesn’t mean that you shouldn’t choose whatever it is that you choose for fun and recreation simply because it includes that factor of pressure, but what it does mean is that everything is a matter of balance, my friend. You can be moving in extremes, in a manner of speaking, and some people actually move in extremes as part of their own normal. And in that, you can move in directions of pressure, but in a balanced capacity. I know that seems to be somewhat of a paradox, but anything can be done in balance if you are actually paying attention.
In that, I would say that if you are moving in a direction of paying attention to what you consume in your diet, I would suggest that you balance that with (pause) perhaps smaller amounts of carbohydrates than other individuals would engage—meaning smaller amounts of fruits and vegetables—but not to be eliminating them, to be engaging them in a balance. And I would say that in addition to that, if you are incorporating more proteins, that would be definitely acceptable.
Now, understand that that doesn’t mean considerable amounts of fat.
JOHN: Right.
ELIAS: That does alter your physiology in a manner that seems to be a benefit temporarily, but eventually that would backfire with you and would not necessarily be beneficial. I would say that moving in a direction of proteins without the fat content would definitely be something that would be consistent with your body consciousness. I would say incorporating proteins such as fish, eggs, poultry—these forms of protein would be good and compatible with your body consciousness. Also, peanut butter. I would say that it is simply a matter of experimenting with what appears to be compatible with your body consciousness, meaning what feels good with your body. Are you understanding?
JOHN: I think so.
ELIAS: In this, it is a matter of paying attention to the signals with your body, but the most important factor is to begin to pay attention to that factor of pressuring yourself.
JOHN: Right. Yeah, I mean that definitely makes sense. I assumed it was not just diet. But so, to stick with the diet piece, is there anything in particular I should NOT be eating? The only thing I really try to avoid is soy, because when I was vegan I ate a lot of soy and my body pretty clearly does not like it, but is there anything else that you’d say I should not eat?
ELIAS: I would agree with the soy. And I would express in addition to that, perhaps (pause) perhaps moving in a direction of not a tremendous amount of fruit. I would limit that.
JOHN: Yeah, I don’t really eat fruit (laughs), to be honest.
ELIAS: Excellent. Excellent.
JOHN: I mean, I’ll have berries once in a while, like in a smoothie, or I’ll eat an apple once in a while, but it’s very rare that I actually eat any fruit.
ELIAS: Very well. And what do you eat in relation to vegetables?
JOHN: Hm. Not much these days. I mean, my general eating patterns haven’t changed that much, but I would say with vegetables the main thing that I eat is greens: kale, spinach. I do like broccoli, but sometimes it almost felt like broccoli in particular was giving me a lot of gas, or I kind of attributed it to the broccoli, so… And then I started wondering, well maybe it’s just kind of brassicas in general, so I haven’t been eating those as much lately, but when I was, mostly greens, broccoli, lots of potatoes, sweet potatoes. I don’t know if you’re considering those vegetables, but (laughs)…
ELIAS: Those would be root vegetables.
JOHN: Right. I do enjoy root vegetables a lot.
ELIAS: And they can be very beneficial. I would say that I would encourage you to be incorporating some dark green vegetable at least once a day, at the very least. And I would express that… What do you consume as filler, or snacks?
JOHN: (Laughs) Uh… I, as much as I don’t want to be doing this, I do it out of convenience. I have a complicated relationship with food, I’m sure you’re aware. (Both laugh) I often will eat bars—nutritional bars, so to speak, protein bars—or what I’ve been doing a lot recently is fig bars, so like a blueberry fig bar or a raspberry fig bar. I’ll eat a lot of those, kind of in between meals. But yeah, that’s the thing that comes to mind most recently.
ELIAS: What I would say is, I would limit that.
JOHN: (Laughs) I shouldn’t eat ten fig bars a day?
ELIAS: Actually, what I would express is, I would limit the figs.
JOHN: Interesting. Okay.
ELIAS: In that also, figs can have the same or very similar effect with your digestive system as prunes or raisins. Raisins, prunes and figs have very similar effects with the digestive system. That is the reason that I would suggest that you limit that.
JOHN: Okay.
ELIAS: Not that they are necessarily bad for you, but they do have that type of effect with the digestive system, and if you are already incorporating difficulties in relation to pressure, then that simply exacerbates it.
JOHN: Okay. What about dairy? I went through a phase… Well, I love dairy products. I don’t basically drink any milk, so to speak, but I love butter. I have butter pretty much every day. I also went through a phase where I was making homemade yogurt. I got really into fermentation, which I still am to some degree, but I would go through sometimes a quart of homemade yogurt a day. Sometimes I debate whether that was good for me or not. But yeah, in general, is dairy, at least in the form of butter and some type of fermented dairy, is that good for me?
ELIAS: Butter is fine. Yogurt, I would say that is acceptable on a limited basis.
JOHN: Okay.
ELIAS: That that can be tricky. It is, with the body consciousness, similar to cheese, and cheese is acceptable on a limited basis, but that I wouldn’t suggest that you be incorporating it considerably or a lot of it, or even actually every day.
JOHN: Oh. No, definitely not every day. I have yogurt now… I’ll get an urge for it and I’ll buy some at the store. And cheese, pretty much I only eat cheese if I have something like pizza as a kind of treat once in a while, so…
ELIAS: I understand. I would say yes, these are forms of dairy that you can incorporate occasionally. Some individuals, I would recommend that they don’t incorporate them or consume them at all, but many individuals tolerate it considerably and it isn’t creating difficulties with their body consciousness. Once again, it is a matter of genuinely paying attention to how your body consciousness is responding to different food sources, and in genuinely paying attention, trust that. Your body WILL tell you what is acceptable and what is not, what is moving in a direction of being beneficial and what is not. It is simply a matter of listening to that and paying attention.
But I would say that for the most part, I would say… Let me express to you that many times when an individual moves in a certain dietary direction, that may not necessarily be natural to their particular body consciousness.
Now, let me qualify this, because I would express that certain dietary choices are not natural to HUMAN body consciousness, but some people tolerate certain types of dietary choices better than other people—such as, some people tolerate being a vegetarian or a vegan better than other people. Neither of those are actually natural to the human body consciousness, but it depends. If the individual that is vegetarian is including fish and eggs in their diet, then it likely will be tolerated well. Vegan is very different. This is definitely not natural to the human body consciousness, and this creates difficulties for most individuals that move in that direction—and most individuals move in that direction for philosophical reasons, not physical reasons.
JOHN: Well, I have no plans to ever be vegan again. You can trust me on that. (Both laugh)
ELIAS: But I would say that if you are paying attention to how you are engaging your diet, meaning balancing whole foods, that is significantly important, and moving in a direction of balancing the protein with the carbohydrates in relation to vegetables, then I would say that it is very likely that your body consciousness will eventually move in a direction of readjusting itself, or what you would term to be righting itself.
Now, what is significant with that, as I said, is to be balancing that with paying attention to the pressure factor. And the pressure factor is not always as blatantly obvious, although I have no doubt that you will understand what I am expressing to you. Pressure is expressed with YOU in work, in relationships, in time, in performance, in expectations; therefore it is something that, in a manner of speaking, runs rampant through you.
JOHN: Yeah. (Both laugh) That does lead me to kind of my next topic, but I just want to stick to the diet for a minute. So, as you know, I work out a lot. My main passion and hobby and whatever is climbing, so I’m training a lot, I’m climbing a lot. I’m relatively sedentary unless I’m at the gym or actively climbing, but I do train very intensely. And so I try to get a lot of protein, and what I’ve been doing lately is, just for simplicity and ease and not wanting to try to cook a lot and deal with it, because I’m (laughs) getting frustrated, it’s easy to just drink protein powder. So, what I’ve been doing for the last (exhales) long time is, most of my protein comes from whey protein, that I just make protein shakes throughout the day. Would it make sense to try to transition, like you’re saying, to more whole food? You know, fish, eggs, meat protein, and maybe not do the whey protein? Or at least not as much or solely, like I’ve been doing?
ELIAS: Definitely. Most definitely. Yes.
JOHN: And I know that in this world of training and nutrition and all that, protein is very much kind of overblown, but I really struggle with knowing how much of an effect does it have, how much protein do I actually need based on what I’m doing.
ELIAS: What I would say to you is, this is an excellent question, and it is an excellent subject to pay attention to and experiment with. This is an excellent direction to be implementing what I am saying to you in relation to paying attention to your body consciousness.
JOHN: Okay.
ELIAS: Let me say to you that you will notice that if you are not incorporating enough protein, your body will communicate that to you in relation to it will be uncomfortable. You will generate muscle spasms. You will generate actual restlessness with your muscles. It will be uncomfortable, AND you likely will generate a type of craving for different types of protein. Therefore, you may realize at some point that you are craving a steak. And you might not eat steak, but you might be craving having a steak because what your body is communicating to you is that you require more protein.
Now; I would say that if you are engaging significant physical activity, such as climbing, then obviously while you are engaging that type of activity—I’m speaking of time frameworks, not the actual moment that you are doing it—but in that, you will obviously require more protein than other times, and therefore it is a matter of adjusting. But—this also is a matter of balance, that moving in a direction of being inactive and then being significantly active in climbing and then being inactive, this is not healthy. It is a matter of engaging your body consciousness in a flow, not stop-start, stop-start, stop-start. That is very hard on the body consciousness. It creates a significant harshness that the body will actually react to and be almost rebellious to, because it is unnatural and it creates a type of shock with the body consciousness repeatedly, and that is not beneficial.
What I would say to you is, this is a matter of discovering some other type of activity that you enjoy to be doing when you AREN’T climbing. Therefore, you could be running, or you could be cycling, or you could be generating some type of weight training, if you like that activity. It is simply a matter of moving in a direction in which you are, once again, creating that balance.
Now; in relation to food, don’t expect that your stool will change immediately, but over time it will. I would also express that balancing in relation to sugar intake will help. I would say that if you are moving in a direction in which you are paying attention to what you are consuming, you will notice that your sugar intake [inaudible] in the consistency of your stool. I would also express that if you are expressing more of an incorporation of consistency in what you eat, AND less protein shakes.
JOHN: (Laughs) Yeah.
ELIAS: Protein shakes are not meant to replace food.
JOHN: Right. I know that, and I would never tell someone to do that, but it’s me, so… (Laughs)
ELIAS: And I understand, but I would express, use your awareness, my friend. And in that, I would say to you that it is important that you don’t move in certain directions simply because it is convenient.
JOHN: Ah, that’s hard. That’s very hard these days.
ELIAS: I definitely understand, but what I would say to you is, this is tremendously important, because what I would say to you is, you likely don’t want to move in directions in which you will be creating significant difficulties or dysfunctions later.
JOHN: I agree.
ELIAS: In that, I would say you may very well create that if you aren’t paying attention to that balance, and I would say that it is important for you to begin now.
JOHN: Okay. Well, the last piece about diet, I drink lots of water. I have for a long time. I try to be very consistent with that. I drink at least two liters every day, if not three or sometimes four. So, I feel good in that respect.
ELIAS: Excellent! Yes.
JOHN: And then also, like I said, I got into fermentation years and years ago. I was very consistent with that for a while. I’m kind of getting back into it, so I make sauerkraut—
ELIAS: That is excellent also.
JOHN: Yeah. So, I eat sauerkraut, sometimes almost every day. More lately I’ve been getting back into the habit of eating just a spoonful or two or three throughout the day of that. I’m not so into the apple cider vinegar. I tried that for a bit, but I was curious about kombucha. I love kombucha, and—
ELIAS: Ah, yes. Yes, definitely.
JOHN: So, that is good for me?
ELIAS: Yes, definitely.
JOHN: Oh, that’s probably the best thing you told me today! (Laughs)
ELIAS: In that, you don’t have to consume apple cider vinegar. That is just something that is simple, easy and is something that the average individual can consume and it will be beneficial to them, and they don’t have to experiment with many different types of fermented foods or beverages; and therefore, it doesn’t require much thought.
BUT—I would say yes, kombucha is excellent. If you like it, I would definitely be encouraging in that direction. I would say that yes, fermented foods and beverages are excellent.
JOHN: Great. Yeah, I think that’s all for food for now. I hear you, and I… Yeah, I will make some changes.
But I assume also… So the next somewhat topic I want to get into was, I’ve been noticing since I’ve lived here for the last three years in North Carolina with my family and parents, I’ve been having more and more pain in my body. My low back pain has gotten much worse, it seems, over time, and then now also I’ve had some neck pain for the last maybe month or two. And (sighs) it seems like my body is reacting, and I’m not quite sure how much of it is related to like you’re talking about with pressure. I’m sure that’s a huge part of it. (Laughs)
But I’ve also been very curious. You know, I’ve been listening to these sessions about the trauma and, you know, repressed memories and all of that kind of thing, and it’s really got me thinking more about that specifically. And I know this could be a much bigger topic that we might not have time to talk about now, but I… Initially when I started listening to that topic, I thought well, that’s interesting. I feel like I’m aware of my trauma. I don’t feel like I’m one of these people who has any repressed memories or some type of hidden trauma that’s affecting me, but now I’m not so sure. And essentially, I’m curious. Is there some trauma that I’m not aware of or I don’t remember that is coming up now?
ELIAS: And what influenced you in that direction?
JOHN: Well, I guess not wanting to just outright dismiss that possibility, because I do feel very self-aware and I’ve done a lot of work on healing myself and addressing to what I would consider my traumas from my past, my childhood. But I also feel like there’s an interesting connection right now, being where I am, being here, back with my family for the first time since I was essentially a kid, a teenager. And I feel like I’m going through this process with my mom. She’s still alive, but she’s definitely moving closer and closer towards disengaging, it seems. And I feel like there’s something there. Most of my trauma or issues, so to speak, I feel like are related to that relationship, more so than anything else. And so it just got me really questioning that. Like, did something happen with her, or am I tapping into something else, or did something else entirely happen? Just the more I listen to those sessions, the more I started questioning that and how this is all related to how I’m feeling these days and my body seemingly reacting to things, and just the overall sense of discomfort and pain and struggle that I’ve been feeling, to be here and be around them.
ELIAS: And what do you remember?
JOHN: (Pause) I mean, I remember a lot of fighting when I was a kid, with my parents and my sister. I don’t remember anything happening to me specifically; it’s just like a lot of things happened around me, if that makes sense. But… yeah.
ELIAS: Such as?
JOHN: (Sighs) I remember seeing my mom and my sister fight, and I remember one time she was on top of my sister. I don’t know if she was hitting her, but she was definitely kind of pinning her to the ground and they were kind of slapping at each other. I remember one of those occasions. I remember just a lot of verbal fighting with my parents, my mom usually yelling a lot. I remember once my dad took me out of the apartment that we were in and he was going to leave her or something but ended up not. And obviously, some of these things I really question whether they’re even dreams, or actual memories, or—
ELIAS: Oh, they are memories.
JOHN: Okay. That’s what I feel.
ELIAS: They are memories.
JOHN: Yeah. But I guess also, to be clear, specifically I’m also really starting to question about like some type of sexual trauma, and that I don’t remember. But I’m aware at this point in my life, my own sexuality has been such a complicated and challenging thing, and I think that’s the piece maybe that started some type of connection was being made, where I’m like okay, I have clearly some serious issues around sexuality, which is a whole separate topic—well, not separate but I guess related topic—and that got me thinking maybe something happened to me sexually that I don’t remember, because I don’t remember anything happening to me or seeing anything like that. I just remember hearing about that topic, and I remember very much internalizing the idea that male sexuality is bad, that male sexuality is dangerous, and from a very young age I always felt like okay, well, I need to be different, I need to control that, I need to not be one of these abusive men. And now it’s at the point where I’m a grown adult, and I still feel so disconnected from my own sexuality because I internalized that message. But I don’t know that something physically actually happened to me or around me.
ELIAS: This is a complicated subject. I would say to you presently that no, YOU didn’t endure sexual abuse or trauma with yourself. Now, as I have expressed, that doesn’t mean that you don’t have trauma in relation to a particular subject, that the individual doesn’t have to be engaged with the action themself. Many times, people are witness to abusive situations, and that is also very traumatic. As I have expressed in recent time frameworks in relation to post-traumatic stress, this is one of those situations in which people can be tremendously traumatized by witnessing violent deaths. But in relation to sexual abuse, this is many, many, many, many times a violent action. Not always; there are actually many times in which it ISN’T a violent action, which becomes even more confusing to the individual that experiences it, because it is a violation but they don’t quite understand that piece, and they don’t know how to reconcile that. And this can be very damaging to an individual because it is so confusing.
But what I would say to you is that most of the trauma—or ALL of the trauma that YOU have experienced—has been through observation, through witnessing rather than experiencing yourself. And I would say that almost all of that has been associated with your sibling.
JOHN: Really.
ELIAS: There is some exception, but I would say most of it, yes, is in relation to what you have witnessed, and that this is extremely understandable that you would be incorporating these issues and that you would hold yourself to significant standards or that you would have significant difficulty in relation to your own sexuality as a male individual and taking personal responsibility for all female individuals—that any individual that you would be attracted to or involved with, that it would be challenging, I would suspect.
JOHN: Very much so. But I’m… I mean, most of what I remember with my sister was interactions with almost entirely my mom. Those are the only traumatic or uncomfortable situations that I remember. Are there other things you’re saying I witnessed that I’m just not remembering anymore?
ELIAS: Yes, but with your mother. (Pause) Don’t think automatically that if someone has been sexually abused that it would be with a male individual, but that this is a very firm message that has been expressed. I would say that your sister doesn’t entirely remember all of the abuses that were expressed with her either, and with good reason. And I would say that in that, your mother was the individual that expressed that and that you were witness to, and that in that, informed that male individuals or men are not to be trusted and that they are… and that they are bad, essentially.
JOHN: Yeah.
ELIAS: That would be expressing it mildly. I would say that she has incorporated much more explicit terms in relation to her perception of male individuals. And let me say to you in this, this stems from her own experiences.
JOHN: Right. Which I am aware of that, to some small degree.
ELIAS: Therefore in that, I would say that as I have expressed recently, those roles of victim and perpetrator are very blurred, because all victims at some point and in some capacity become a perpetrator. All perpetrators have been victims. But in that, that doesn’t necessarily mean that a perpetrator is being a perpetrator to someone else; sometimes they are being that to themself. But many times they are expressing it in relation to other people, and many, many, many, many people do this in relation to their own children.
[The timer for the end of the session rings.]
JOHN: So, I’m still a little confused. I mean, are you saying that my mom…? So, my sister shared with me since I moved here, just in the last few years, that there were situations and things that happened between her and my mom that I didn’t know about, and she made it clear that she felt like, yeah, it was abuse; that’s how she would phrase it. So, are you saying that I…? Was there something sexual that happened between them?
ELIAS: Yes.
JOHN: And I was witness to that when I was young?
ELIAS: Only momentarily; and in that, that was enough. And what ensued subsequent to that in relation to expressions that your mother generated with you in telling you how bad men are, that was all connected.
JOHN: Right. Okay. (Sighs) (Laughs uncomfortably) Mm. Yeah.
ELIAS: I understand, my friend. It can be somewhat overwhelming when you are looking at these cans of worms.
JOHN: Yeah, but you know it’s interesting, thinking about this more and talking with friends about this, I don’t know; I feel in a way like I’m ready, and so it doesn’t… In a strange way it feels somewhat manageable. I feel like this is the time and I feel ready, and—
ELIAS: That is excellent, my friend. And in that, I would be definitely acknowledging you, because in that, when you are ready to address in these capacities, it can be somewhat overwhelming but it definitely is more manageable. And although it may be overwhelming at this moment, I would say that when you are ready you generally will move considerably quickly.
JOHN: Um, yeah. So, just one more question about that. Was that a one-time event with them, in terms of the sexual piece I guess? Or was it more of an ongoing experience?
ELIAS: I would say it wasn’t one time only between them, but it was one time only that you briefly witnessed that.
JOHN: Okay. Well, yeah, I want to keep talking about this now, now that we’ve opened this can of worms, but I had talked to Mary about setting up monthly half-hour sessions at this point because I feel ready to have more consistent conversations and address to these things, so…
ELIAS: Very well.
JOHN: We can pick up next time. I did have one quick question, though. I had forgotten about this, but I wanted to ask you: I still have not really done much with connecting with Austin, other than the occasional meditation, but I had a reiki session with a friend of mine who is doing reiki sessions with friends, and I just invited Austin into that space, or into my energy, and was curious what would happen during the session. And I got this very clear image where she, I guess, showed up, and she handed me a sword and I felt or heard the word—I can’t remember the word now, but I feel it was something like “employ.” So I’m curious what that was.
ELIAS: I would say that that was an actual connection, and the word was not “employ,” it was “deploy.”
JOHN: “Deploy.” Okay.
ELIAS: And I would say in that, that it was an encouragement for you to be moving in a direction of empowering yourself.
JOHN: Yeah. That’s pretty much what I took it as, but I was just curious. Yeah.
(Laughs) Actually, one more quick question that I didn’t think about until right now, but was my dad aware of that piece between my mom and sister?
ELIAS: No.
JOHN: Okay. I didn’t think so, but… Okay. We will continue hopefully I guess next month.
ELIAS: Very well, my friend. I shall be anticipating our next meeting. In tremendous love to you and in great encouragement in your new direction, until our next meeting, au revoir.
JOHN: Goodbye.
(Elias departs after 1 hour 4 minutes)
©2021 Mary Ennis. All Rights Reserved.
Copyright 2021 Mary Ennis, All Rights Reserved.