Wednesday, July 7, 2004 (Private/Phone)
Participants: Mary (Michael) and Oge (Yentil)
Elias arrives at 6:19 AM. (Arrival time is 14 seconds.)

ELIAS: Good afternoon!

OGE: Hello, Elias! (Elias chuckles) Good afternoon! It's been a while.

ELIAS: And what shall we discuss?

OGE: I think you know what we're going to discuss now. Before I spoke to Mary, I didn't have any kind of idea. I had a vague idea what I wanted to talk about, but I still want to discuss it within that framework, which is trusting self, yes?

ELIAS: Very well.

OGE: But in talking to Mary I realized what I would like to also look at is extremes and balance and bringing more of a balance into my day-to-day life.

ELIAS: Very well. And in this, what do you view...

OGE: But before we go ahead, Elias, the last time we spoke - I totally forgot; it skipped my mind - I was going to ask you things like essence family name, which I didn't ask you the last time. Would you be able to give me that essence family name for me?

ELIAS: And what is your impression?

OGE: I got a name out of the blue. I don't know if it's a focus or it's to do with an essence name, but I got Benjamin. Is there any link there?

ELIAS: That would be a focus.

OGE: Benjamin's a focus?

ELIAS: Yes.

OGE: I want to ask you about him because he's quite exciting. (Elias laughs) But no, I haven't got any impressions on essence family name.

ELIAS: Essence name (pause), Yentil (YEN till).

OGE: Can you spell that for me, Elias, please?

ELIAS: Y-E-N-T-I-L.

OGE: How do you pronounce that?

ELIAS: Yentil.

OGE: Enshill?

ELIAS: No, no, no! Yentil, Y-E-N-T-I-L.

OGE: Ah! Thanks. That's not doing anything for me at the moment, but I'll stay with that.

ELIAS: (Laughs) And what is your impression as to your essence families and alignment?

OGE: Sumafi, alignment Gramada.

ELIAS: Correct. (Chuckles) (Pause)

OGE: Is that correct?

ELIAS: Yes.

OGE: Yes, because we talked about it last time, Sumafi and alignment Gramada. (Elias laughs)

Also, Elias, I wanted to know my intent in this focus. I have been reading a few of your transcripts, and I've been trying to work out what it might be, but again I'm having a bit of difficulty doing that. One thing I do know that I like is processes, and I wondered if it had anything to do with processes. I am intrigued or interested in processes.

For example, as a kid I used to like the Lego and jigsaw puzzles and reading and taking things apart and putting them together. I wondered if there was a link there with my intent in this focus.

ELIAS: Yes, you are correct.

OGE: Okay... (Laughs) Help! Help!

ELIAS: It would be an exploration of processes, but also mechanisms and how mechanisms generate different processes in different situations. You generate many different specific avenues to explore different types of processes and mechanisms.

OGE: Would you give me an example, just so I can make that more real?

ELIAS: And what do you view as...

OGE: What do I feel?

ELIAS: Yes.

OGE: Well, the work I've been doing up until recently, certainly the areas I've been interested in, are like systems and how certain systems lead to certain outcomes and how certain things will generate certain outcomes. That's been an interest in the work I've been doing up until recently. Would that be what you're talking about?

ELIAS: Yes, which also is associated with what you are doing now in exploring your own process and how certain choices generate certain outcomes, and exploring the types of energy that may be manipulated to be accomplishing or not accomplishing what you want - which is yet again another process - and the mechanisms involved in that process - which would be your choices and beliefs and the type of energy that you project - that create certain perceptions and therefore generates certain realities, and the puzzle of yourself. Ha ha ha!

OGE: Yes, it is a puzzle. I've still to say something at the moment, though, Elias. I am at this point quite anxious about this conversation, so I'd like to explore that. I just thought, while I was listening to you, that I'm quite anxious. I don't know if agitated is the word, but I'd like to explore what's happening right now, why I am anxious about this.

ELIAS: And what is your assessment?

OGE: The first one is linked into something, again, I read in one of the transcripts, which really rang true with me. I think I approach these sessions as a sort of a teacher and a pupil kind of thing, and there's a part of me that's anxious about getting told off and not getting it right. (Elias laughs) Which is quite odd, because sort of intellectually I know that that's almost silly, but emotionally I am feeling that.

ELIAS: And what are you discounting and defending within yourself that is generating that communication?

OGE: I suppose that I'm making myself wrong, I think.

ELIAS: And what are you defending?

OGE: What am I defending? I don't know! Nothing! (Laughs and Elias chuckles) What am I defending? That I don't want to be wrong, I think. I think that's it.

ELIAS: Partially. I may express to you that you are discounting yourself and generating this expression that you do not incorporate enough information and therefore you do not know enough, and that triggers an automatic defense.

OGE: Yeah, that's it. So how do I work with that? I think the first thing is actually recognizing that's there, because just in recognizing it, it's kind of eased a bit.

ELIAS: Yes.

OGE: So acknowledging that that's what I'm feeling now has eased it a bit.

ELIAS: Correct. In this, an element of the process is to recognize and identify what the signal is first. The signal is the feeling.
Once you identify what the signal is, you move into the next step, which is to identify what the message is associated with that signal. The signal was anxiousness, and the message concerns discounting and defending.

Once you identify that, you question yourself. What are you discounting and what is generating the defensiveness? What are you shielding? As you allow yourself to evaluate further, you recognize that you are in this moment expressing a belief that you do not incorporate adequate information. Therefore, what you are expressing in your own communication to yourself is that you do not feel informed enough to be engaging conversation with myself. Therefore, you are also automatically generating a shielding or a defensiveness. The defensiveness is expressed in relation to the projection of attention to myself in anticipation of my reflection of your discounting, which I do not necessarily engage.

Let me express to you, I do not participate in physical manifestation within your physical reality. Therefore, I am not bound to the blueprints of your reality, [and] therefore I do not incorporate the beliefs that you incorporate.

Now; in this, I also am in part a reflection to you - the reflective element of your curiosity and your desire to offer yourself information. But I am not necessarily a reflection of what you are generating in energy.

Within your physical reality, this is a natural and what you would term to be normal automatic expression. You all generate this with each other and with your environment and with any aspect of consciousness that you interact with. You reflect the energy that you project, and this is what creates all of your scenarios and all of your experiences within your physical reality. This is a natural expression. Generally speaking, other individuals or other expressions of consciousness do not necessarily automatically reconfigure your energy. Therefore, they receive your energy and they reflect it in the manner that it has been received.

I do not necessarily generate that action with any of you. Therefore, regardless of the energy that you are projecting in discounting and shielding yourself, I DO reconfigure that to offer you information, and not to discount you and not to generate a conflicting or discounting or discouraging reflection.

Now; in this, what you have presented in this example in this experience presently is an opportunity to view automatic responses. You generate that with myself, for you would generate that type of automatic response with another individual that you view to be an authority or one that you view to incorporate more information than do you.

But it is not that you do not incorporate information; it is just a matter of becoming familiar with how to access the information that you hold. I do not incorporate more information than do you. I merely am aware of how to access that information, and you have forgotten. You are generating your process to be creating that remembrance and generating an intimate relationship and knowing of yourself to allow you to objectively create what you want and to understand what you are creating.

OGE: What are the automatic responses you're referring to, Elias?

ELIAS: The automatic response that you generated was the anxiety.

OGE: Oh, is that? I thought that was a feeling.

ELIAS: That is also an automatic response, for it is generated by all of those expressions that we have identified in this one example: the beliefs, the action of immediately discounting yourself, immediately shielding, immediately projecting your attention to myself - which is another automatic response - and generating this apprehension of what I may say to you.

OGE: Am I emotion focused? I think I am.

ELIAS: Yes.

OGE: Because I do process things through emotion, definitely through feeling first.

ELIAS: Yes.

OGE: Let's stay with this, because I am interested in staying with this, Elias, and working through this. So I've recognized the automatic response, which is anxiety. How do I work with that then to reconfigure it?

ELIAS: This is what we have examined. You allow yourself to move beyond merely the signal. You recognize the signal. Now, what is the message? What are you DOING?

OGE: What I am doing is defending myself.

ELIAS: Correct. What are you defending?

OGE: Two things, like you said. One is that I don't know enough, that was the first thing. The second one ... there was another one. But at the moment, staying with that, that I don't know enough.

ELIAS: Very well. You have offered yourself information.

Now; once you recognize what you are doing, that offers you information. You now have recognized the feeling - the anxiety. You've recognized that you are communicating to yourself - discounting yourself and defending yourself.

Once you have recognized that you are defending yourself, you thusly move into questioning yourself. What are you defending? Now you have offered yourself information that you are defending yourself for you view yourself to not incorporate enough information, or not as much information as the other individual or myself.

Once you recognize the reason that you are defending, which is that you do not incorporate enough information, you move into the identification of what triggers that. What triggers that is that you believe or you incorporate an expressed belief that there are individuals or essences that incorporate more information than you, [and] therefore are better.

Once you recognize THAT information, you may recognize that that may be one of your truths, which is a belief that you have generated into an absolute, and therefore you do not question it and therefore you generate these automatic responses. Once you move to the point in which you can recognize that this is one of your truths, you may dissipate that by realizing it may be one of your truths, but it is not true. (Pause)

Now; also recognize that every belief, every truth, incorporates more than one influence. Your automatic response is generated in choosing the influence that discounts you. But that same belief, that same truth, incorporates other influences, and you may choose which influences are more in keeping with your preferences.

You may incorporate that same truth of not knowing as much as another individual or as another essence objectively, and rather than discounting yourself and defending yourself, you may incorporate the choice to express another influence of that truth, which would be to incorporate it as a motivation to allow yourself a new adventure in exploration.

OGE: I see where the automatic response narrows my choices, because if I'm automatically discounting myself then I'm not exploring. So it's not the belief in itself that's the issue, it's how I allow it to influence me.

ELIAS: Correct! As you are not eliminating beliefs, it is significant that you allow yourself to recognize their influences, and therefore allow yourself the freedom to choose which influences you prefer rather than being bound to the automatic responses, which are limiting.

OGE: That's one of the things I've had difficulties with, Elias. Sometimes I get really frustrated and angry because something will come up and I say to myself, "Well, you've got a choice," but I can't see the choices.

ELIAS: I am under...

OGE: Is that because of an automatic response, usually? When you can't see other choices, there's an automatic response there?

ELIAS: Yes. And automatic responses are precisely that - they are automatic. Therefore, they do not require thought. You merely do them.

OGE: How do you recognize them, though? Because they're quite hard. Especially if it's something you do every day, it becomes automatic. If you hadn't pointed this out ... I mean, it's so obvious now that you've said it, but I would have had difficulty working out my automatic response.

ELIAS: But...

OGE: Now that you've said it, it's very clear and obvious.

ELIAS: I am understanding. This is the reason that it is important to be paying attention to what you are actually doing. This is very significant, for this is where your information lies and how you begin to evaluate what your automatic responses are, what your choices are, what the influences of your beliefs are, by paying attention to what you are actually doing, what you are actually expressing, what type of energy you are projecting, what communications you are expressing to yourself. All of these actions are important, and the one that you are the most unfamiliar with is actually genuinely paying attention to what you are doing.

OGE: Would another way of exploring automatic responses be, certainly for me, working from what my physical body is doing and saying? Would that be another way? Because that's another avenue I'm interested in working with.

ELIAS: Yes.

OGE: I'll give another example. I've had this pain in the back of my neck for a while. That's saying something to me, but I'm not clear what it's saying. I just know I've got a pain in the back of my neck, which I've had for a while. It's actually still there. How would I then...? I'd like to work with you to work through what the message is in there.

ELIAS: Very well. Once again, as I have expressed, the most unfamiliar expression is to be noticing what you are actually doing.

Now; in association with your physical body, what are you doing?

OGE: Right now I would say I am generating pain on the left-hand side in my neck.

ELIAS: That is the symptom. But what are you doing?

OGE: With the pain?

ELIAS: What are you doing that generates that pain?

OGE: I don't know.

ELIAS: (Chuckles) Now; in this moment, allow yourself to be aware and feel your physical body. Feel your muscles within your shoulders and your neck.

OGE: Tension.

ELIAS: Yes. Therefore, what are you doing?

OGE: Generating tension?

ELIAS: Yes. You are holding tightly to your energy in this physical area and creating tension, and that tension is constricting your actual physical muscles, and the physical constriction of the muscles is generating pressure with nerves, and that is creating pain.

OGE: I will stay with that for a bit, Elias.

ELIAS: Now; what are you expressing in energy that generates the tension?

OGE: Fear.

ELIAS: Of what?

OGE: More specifically, I would say, with the neck, it's fear of... It's survival, how I'm going to get by on a day-to-day basis, because I'm not working at the moment.

ELIAS: Correct, therefore that generates an underlying continuous tension which generates the constriction physically, which generates the pain. And what does this also do?

OGE: What, the pain?

ELIAS: ALL of this. The energy that you are projecting, what is it also doing, other than generating pain?

OGE: It's generating tension...

ELIAS: And what is that energy also doing? It is creating precisely what you do not want. It is restricting your mobility, it is constricting your allowance of imagination, it is restricting your movement in creativity, and therefore it is perpetuating the circle.

OGE: Staying with that, then, so I've recognized that. What I'd like to do now in this moment is get to the belief behind that.

ELIAS: This is another point. Generally speaking, in any of these types of experiences there is more than one belief that is being expressed.

One that is being expressed is that, once again, you are being inadequate. You are not valuing yourself, for you are not generating productivity, and in not generating productivity, you are expressing yourself inadequately, which is a strongly expressed belief - measuring your worth to what you produce rather than appreciating yourself as you are - and generating expectations of yourself in association with beliefs concerning responsibility, beliefs concerning behaviors...

OGE: Behaviors?

ELIAS: Correct or right behaviors and wrong behaviors. Right behaviors are productive; wrong behaviors are not productive and therefore are lazy.

OGE: (Laughs) That's true!

ELIAS: And I may also express to you that many of these beliefs are being expressed in black and white terms, and therefore are somewhat in extreme. Either you are productive or you are lazy. If you are not incorporating certain actions and incorporating employment, you are expressing being irresponsible.

You are also expressing beliefs concerning relationships and what you expect of yourself in association with relationships, and that if you are not productive, you are a burden.

OGE: Yeah, that's one I've recognized.

ELIAS: And therefore once again you are inadequately expressing yourself.

Now; recognize that what you are doing is you are projecting the energy of all of these beliefs and all of these negative influences of these beliefs. In this, as you begin to become familiar with the influences of your beliefs and recognize that those are each merely one influence and that there are other influences, you allow yourself a greater freedom and you allow yourself choice. In allowing yourself choice, you automatically release energy, which releases the tension, which automatically allows the body consciousness to relax and to return to its natural state.

You may as easily generate a different expression as automatically and easily as you have created this. In this, you have quite easily and efficiently generated expressing an energy outwardly which is perpetuating certain influences of each of these beliefs. But in evaluating those same beliefs, you may begin to acknowledge yourself and generate an appreciation and incorporate different influences of those beliefs.

A different influence of the belief concerning the relationship is that within this time framework of not expressing the same kind of productivity, that is not to say that you are not creating another kind of productivity and an opportunity to be incorporating a time framework of genuinely expressing an appreciation for yourself and for the other individual in the relationship.

You may also incorporate a different influence of the belief of responsibility, not discounting yourself that you are not being responsible, but alter what you are doing and express that appreciation for yourself and allow yourself to be responsible for you, and in being responsible for you, be nurturing of you, which is also an expression of responsibility.

As to your belief concerning productivity, rather than choosing the automatic response that you are not being productive for you are not being productive in a manner which involves employment, to once again be appreciative and notice what you ARE being productive with and what you are producing. Which may not be money, but you may be producing other expressions that are equally if not more so valuable.

OGE: Thank you! Thank you, Elias. There's a lot to go on there. There's a lot.

ELIAS: Influences of beliefs are quite significant, for therein lies your expression of freedom, your choices, in which you allow yourself your expressions and to create what you want, rather than discounting yourself and perpetuating the type of energy that influences the creation of a reality that you do not want.

The energy that you express outwardly is the energy that you reflect within your reality. Therefore, I may express to you that regardless of what you think, you may be incorporating thought and identifying somewhat of what you do want, but you may not necessarily create that, dependent upon what type of energy you are projecting. You offer yourself little avenues of information in projecting the type of energy that you have been, for you constrict your information, you constrict your creativity, and you constrict your communication of imagination, and those expressions allow you much more freedom of mobility and inspiration to be generating what you want.

OGE: I wasn't aware that I did that, especially more so with my imagination. I wasn't aware that I constrict that, or not consciously, anyway.

ELIAS: Allowing yourself to relax would be the first step. In that, allowing yourself to playfully engage imagination would be quite purposeful, for this may allow you to creatively offer yourself information, interrupt the energy that you have been projecting, and inspire yourself to be moving in a direction that shall allow you to generate income, but in a playful manner.

OGE: Physical exercise, I find, helps me to relax.

ELIAS: At times, yes.

OGE: Like walking.

ELIAS: Yes, and perhaps you may engage walking each day to allow yourself that expression of relaxing. But upon your walks, also allow yourself to notice your environment and to be incorporating your imagination, and perhaps you shall surprise yourself. (Chuckles)

OGE: Okay, Elias. It's all gone rather serious!

ELIAS: (Laughs) But not necessarily, for once again this conversation may be interpreted and perceived as the beginning of a new adventure...

OGE: It is!

ELIAS: ...and a manner in which you may begin to incorporate a playfulness that you have not been allowing yourself recently. (Chuckles)

OGE: It's hard to do something, or it's more difficult to do something that you're not used to doing, though, isn't it?

ELIAS: I am quite aware. It is challenging. But this is the significance of practicing, for as you practice it becomes easier, for it becomes more familiar.

OGE: I'm sitting here thinking, "Gosh, how do I relax? How do I become more playful?" Overwhelm, overwhelm! But I hear you.

ELIAS: (Chuckles) How do you relax? You choose intentionally to be relaxing. You focus somewhat, not intensely and not forcingly, but focus upon the physical areas of your physical body and intentionally allow yourself to relax those muscles. As you relax one muscle, allow yourself to relax another muscle. And incorporate breathing, for that is a natural action that automatically releases tension. The action of incorporating even, deep breaths is a natural releasing of energy. It is quite difficult to hold in tension if you are incorporating that action.

OGE: You haven't told me anything there with the breathing that I don't actually know. I've been telling myself that, but I just haven't been doing it.

ELIAS: I am aware. It matters not whether you incorporate the information or not, but whether you incorporate the action or not. (Laughs)

OGE: Just before we go, because I think we've got about ten minutes or so, I want to explore Benjamin, Elias. That came to me one day, just out of the blue. I found the energy with Benjamin quite exciting. I got some impressions, which I want to sort of validate. I think Benjamin is a dancer.

ELIAS: Correct.

OGE: He's also a leader of some sort. Would that be correct, some kind of quite influential figure?

ELIAS: In a manner of speaking, for the individual also incorporates engaging choreography.

OGE: That's something I'm interested in and would like to try and have a go at. I think that's why I got that.

There's also another focus which is - what would you say? - in this time framework in America. Would that be correct?

ELIAS: Yes.

OGE: A male in America?

ELIAS: Yes.

OGE: Big, I see him, and carries a lot of weight around his stomach area.

ELIAS: (Chuckles) Yes.

OGE: Works in a library or works with books?

ELIAS: With books.

OGE: Also works with children?

ELIAS: Partially.

OGE: The other one is what I would call a future focus - female, a scientist.

ELIAS: Correct.

OGE: I get this impression that she's on the verge of discovering or making some kind of discovery but can't quite tweak it right. I think that's because she's ignoring her heart quite a bit. Is that correct?

ELIAS: Correct.

OGE: Why have I linked in with these focuses? The future one and the American one I got quite strong. Benjamin's more recently, definitely more recently I've got him.

ELIAS: I may express to you that you are tapping into these focuses to be introducing yourself to more of a playful energy and as a means to be lightening your energy, offering yourself an avenue to explore that shall offer you an action that you would assess to be productive, but in a playful manner and not incorporating so much seriousness. (Chuckles)

OGE: But the American focus, he's quite serious. He's what I would call, what I would interpret, as right wing. Does that make sense?

ELIAS: I am understanding, but this also...

OGE: Quite right wing, and I also got the impression, Elias, that he's seen me sort of in dreams or we've met in dreams, and he's found that quite disturbing.

ELIAS: Yes, you are correct. But recognize how you incorporate that in a playful manner, for you view that to be humorous. Regardless of the seriousness of the other individual, you incorporate a humorous perception of your connecting with him, and therefore it does generate more of a lightness in your energy.

OGE: Benjamin's quite short! (Elias chuckles) I thought he was a bit short. The other two are quite tall.

ELIAS: Correct.

OGE: What I would call tall.

ELIAS: Yes.

OGE: That's interesting. The last time I spoke to you, you gave me a focus with Emma, my partner, to explore. I think it was - where were we? We played a lot with (inaudible) and that.

ELIAS: Correct.

OGE: Something else did come out of that, and that was that my son, certainly my older one Trevor, was a focus in that time, possibly my father.

ELIAS: Yes.

OGE: Was that correct?

ELIAS: Yes.

OGE: And he disapproved of my relationship.

ELIAS: Correct.

OGE: Oh, that's interesting. I must say, Emma's not into all of this at the moment, so it's quite difficult discussing it with her. (Elias laughs) When I tell her about these focuses, she thinks it's just my imagination. So, she's not quite into it at the moment. I find that frustrating, discussing it with her. Do you understand what I mean?

ELIAS: Yes, I am understanding. But that also may alter if you are allowing yourself to be less serious and more playful.

OGE: Just before I go, before I finish, has Emma got a focus in Germany, part of Hitler's Germany?

ELIAS: Yes.

OGE: That I saw as well.

Elias, I'm going to go now because I think the time's almost up, but one more thing before we go. About a month ago, my friend was round, and when she comes round we do this linking and we do readings for each other. I was convinced you were there that evening. Were you there that evening?

ELIAS: Yes.

OGE: Were you trying to tell her to tell me to lighten up?

ELIAS: In a manner of speaking.

OGE: Yes, I thought it was! I thought it was! (Elias laughs) She couldn't understand what happened to her, but I had a little inkling what was happening to her. We still talk about it now. (Elias laughs)

How do you present yourself to me when you're around? Because I know I do talk to you, and there are times I talk to you and I get answers. I am certain I do.

ELIAS: Yes.

OGE: It might not come immediately, but it does. Like one day I was really distraught and I was like, "Elias, help, help, help!" Then I thought about the last reading I did, and I put the tape on and everything I needed to know was on that tape. (Elias laughs) Was that you? That was you.

ELIAS: Yes.

OGE: So how do you present yourself to me? Because I was reading in another transcript and you were saying sometimes your energy is quite calm.

ELIAS: I may express to you that my energy is available and present continuously. It is merely a matter of whether you are allowing yourself an openness to it.

OGE: All right then, Elias. It was nice talking to you again.

ELIAS: And you also. (Chuckles)

OGE: I shall be speaking to you again, no doubt quite soon.

ELIAS: Very well. I shall be anticipating that, and I...

OGE: Thank you very much.

ELIAS: You are quite welcome, my friend. I express to you in great affection, au revoir.

OGE: Bye-bye.

Elias departs at 7:21 AM.

(1) Oge is calling from Europe.

©2004 Mary Ennis, All Rights Reserved

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Copyright 2004 Mary Ennis, All Rights Reserved.