Session 200704191


“Responsibility and Caring”
“Body Signals”
“Engaging But Opposing Preferences”
“How Creating Your Own Reality Works”
“The PP Practice”

Session 20070419 (2247)
“Responsibility and Caring”
“Body Signals”
“Engaging But Opposing Preferences”
“How Creating Your Own Reality Works”
“The PP Practice”

Thursday, April 19, 2007 (Private/Phone)

Participants: Mary (Michael) and Katrin (Duncan)

ELIAS: Good afternoon!

KATRIN: Good afternoon, Elias. I am a bit nervous today. After all the sessions, I'm still nervous to talk to you. (Elias laughs)

Okay. I’d like to start with an observation of myself which I believe comes to my attention only in this time framework, but I know it has been a constant expression for a long time framework. I have to give an example: I'm turning a board with my grandson, and he asks me for a prescription medication. I'm cooperative, and I organize it. I notice that he himself expressed discomfort with his breathing and he asked me for medication. After a while I start to worry—not so much about him, more about myself. I watch his breathing, but underneath I communicate to myself that I am not adequate enough to take on the responsibility in case it is getting more uncomfortable for him. This is my anticipation. The action feels all right.

There are two translations I have. The first one is I know that I am not responsible for him, and he showed it profoundly in this action to ask for medication. Second, I am aware of another focus of mine who has lost a smaller child, what she believes through neglect. This knowing helped me along with looking after children in previous time frameworks.

I don’t understand what I’m doing here in this anticipation, which gave me cramps in my toes, a signal of immobilizing myself.

Could you explain to me what I am associating here in this anticipation, please?

ELIAS: First of all, I will express a validation that you are correct in your assessments and in association with the other focus. And I will also express to you, although you recognize that you are not responsible for him, that is more intellectual than it is experiential. For although you can express to yourself that you are not responsible for him or his choices, you also CARE about him and what he does, and you care about his comfort. And that translates into a feeling of being somewhat responsible for him, for he is small and you incorporate, in your assessment, more abilities to care for him and that is your role.

And in that, I understand that you express to yourself that he is generating his choices and that you are not responsible for his choices. But regardless of whether you express that to yourself or not, it is significant that you noticed that you generated this apprehension regardless. That is your signal that you actually do incorporate SOME sense of responsibility for this individual in association with caring for him.

In this, what is the most significant is that you recognized the apprehension. Regardless of whether it confused you or not, you were paying attention.

Now; this type of feeling of responsibility for another individual is not bad. In this, you can acknowledge yourself that he is generating his choices, but you can also acknowledge yourself that you do care. And in that caring, you naturally express some element of responsibility, for you are being responsible to yourself also. For in that, you are noticing your own guidelines and your natural expression.

Therefore, I would express to you not to discount yourself that you incorporated this experience and these feelings, but rather acknowledge yourself that you noticed that and acknowledge to yourself that this is a natural expression for you.

The reason that you generated the reaction in the physical expression that YOU incorporated is that when you begin to experience some type of apprehension or anxiety in association with another individual and you immediately remind yourself that you are not responsible, what you are doing is opposing your own natural expression, and that creates the physical expression that you experience.

Whereas, if you are noticing that you are beginning to generate the apprehension or the anxiety, you can merely acknowledge that and evaluate whether you are actually incorporating personal responsibility for another individual or whether you are actually merely expressing your own natural caring but also acknowledging that the other individual is generating their choices adequately enough.

Therefore, in this experience, in a manner of speaking, you generated half of the action. You did acknowledge his choices, you did recognize that HE was all right, but you did not acknowledge yourself.

KATRIN: Mm-hm. I have well understood. Thank you very much. I mean, the problem for me was at this moment realizing that I worried about him, that in energy I would transfer it to him and he would be a bit annoyed that I’m worried about him—not in words, just energy-wise. But I noticed he didn’t. He wasn’t. He wasn’t, but this was my worry in that moment. And I realized that I had the apprehension towards my own assessment that he is all right, and I still continued with this physical manifestation.

ELIAS: And that was your opposing of yourself, and not allowing yourself to merely express your natural caring. And in that, it would have allowed you to relax and accept genuinely his ability, but also it would have allowed you to accept your own expression.

KATRIN: Mm-hm. I have understood you. It will help me along. I will have more of those occasions, I believe. (Elias laughs) I will remind myself what you have said.

I mean, I’m coming back to my grandson. At least once a day he has slight breathing difficulties. He somehow has a blocked nose. He accepts it. Is my impression correct that it has something to do with his intent, exploring limits and no limits? This is an information I get for quite a while when I observe him.

ELIAS: Yes.

KATRIN: Mm. And is my impression correct, too, to say that when he is somehow forced to continue with the medication he is getting irritated, he turns aggressive because he feels, let’s say, interrupted to express his intent in his own manner? I am asking because we have two child physicians in our family who suggest certain tests and other measures to prevent him having breathing difficulties, and I think it’s not necessary. That’s what I believe, but I can’t speak for him. It’s just that I thought he reacts so aggressively when he has to continue with the medication.

ELIAS: Yes, I would agree, although even if he engages the medication, he will choose another avenue to express his intent.

KATRIN: But he does already, because that’s why I noticed in the following days. If he continues to take the medication, because it’s been prescribed for a certain time, he practices his intent, so to speak, let’s say with grown-ups or so. He is a very kind person, but when he gets aggressive he tests his limits for how far he can go. So, he has another avenue to express it, that’s right, but it’s not that comfortable for the environment. (Both laugh) And he gets in trouble in school. Well, this is his choice, actually. It’s just realizing it.

I’m sure you are very aware how when I talk about my grandson, he is the most challenging person I have met in this focus—challenging in the sense of being extremely supportive in my desire to be more aware of myself. Sometimes he looks into my eyes and I can sense a knowing, that he knows what he's doing. I receive his energy actually as similar to yours, very supportive. Can you give me some more information about our relationship? I can’t get any impression apart from… ah, well, he’s quite important for me.

ELIAS: I would agree. And I would express that within each of your pools of probabilities, you have chosen to engage this relationship quite purposefully—you, to be offering yourself more information through him, as reflecting to you, quite well, and HE, in drawing a support from you of his choices and an understanding from you which is encouraging to him. And therefore it creates a type of nurturing energy for his natural expressions, which is quite valuable. Therefore, you mutually offer to each other valuable aspects.

KATRIN: Mm-hm. And that’s why I feel so supported or comfortable with him. It’s very exciting with him and… Yes. Thank you very much for the explanation.

ELIAS: You are quite welcome.

KATRIN: I want to talk about a dream: I enter a house where a man is sitting, quite relaxed. I feel that I know him. My daughter comes in, and the man asks her to marry him. I am not sure, but I believe she accepts it. Then I go to a spa spontaneously and ask whether they could provide me with all the gadgets I need in a spa. I notice quite a number of small, orange-colored bags which are for sale. On my way to the treating rooms I meet a friend and former colleague of mine. She has one of these orange bags. I somehow envy her, that she has that bag.

The impression is that orange has something to do with my daughter. Her focus color is orange. I am quite comfortable with her and relaxed in this time framework. Why I envied the bag, I don’t know. Do I envy my daughter? I don’t know. The marriage proposal might have something to do again, but I feel comfortable with my daughter. I don’t interfere in her life anymore, apart from being in cooperation with her to look after her son, my grandson.

ELIAS: I would express that the spa was a symbol of your comfort with your daughter, and the man was also a symbol of a comfort that you express with your daughter in security. The bag, although it did offer you the association with your daughter—which was significant, for there is imagery that IS concerning your relationship with your daughter in reflecting that comfort—but the bag actually was not a symbol of your daughter. The bag was that specific color associated with my dear one, Patel. And the reason that you were envious of the bag is that that is the symbol for fun.

KATRIN: Oh. I couldn’t have known that. (Both laugh) This is the symbol for fun. Mm-hm. I talk about fun later in this session, hopefully, if I come to this one. (Elias laughs) Thank you.

In one of the last sessions we talked about an experience I have with the input of my physical senses. You suggested that I can use the distortion of the input to intentionally manipulate energy to alter this distortion. What I came up with was not what I expected.

In former time frameworks, I was able to heal ailments with a bright light when I closed my eyes. I used this energy to change physical manifestations. This time I concentrated on my running eye, for example, without closing my eyes. I didn’t know what or how to manipulate energy, but I kept concentrating on the eye. This way I provided myself with an information how I perceive myself, how I see myself. I used this information to change my perception about myself, and my eye stopped running. All I want to ask is, do you mean my intentionally manipulating energy, that it is not so much concentrating on the limitation, instead to use the physical expression to receive the information what is being expressed?

ELIAS: Yes.

KATRIN: It is that?

ELIAS: Yes. Congratulations.

KATRIN: Sorry. I can’t hear you.

ELIAS: I express congratulations on your successfulness.

KATRIN: Ah. Thank you. (Both laugh) I make it sound terribly complicated. I didn’t know what you meant with manipulating. (Elias laughs)

Now I want to check with you what I came up with the other physical senses. When I concentrated on my hearing, I communicated to myself that I am not concentrating on myself, concentrating on my preferences in interactions with other people. I am reacting to expressions which I don’t like. Is this a viable translation, or…?

ELIAS: Yes.

KATRIN: Mm-hm?

ELIAS: I would agree.

KATRIN: And when I concentrated on my throat, I received a similar information. I have an automatic expression to comment verbally to different expressions. I am not free of it yet, but I have lessened it and my throat doesn’t hurt any more. Is that valuable as well for me as a communication from this physical expression?

ELIAS: Yes. I would agree.

KATRIN: It does. But now, one expression I find not that easy to address to. I'm scuppered here. The manifestation is expressed somewhere in my forehead or nose or back in my throat through a sticky mucus. I can’t locate where it comes from [inaudible]. I am even not sure whether it restricts my breathing or it frees my breathing. I can’t distinguish it.

I’ll give an example of noticing it more strongly than usual. I skipped [out] one night to eat, chat, drink, smoke with an old friend of mine and only slept a couple of hours in the morning. I felt a bit hangoverish when I got up, but I suggested to myself that it had been such a wonderful night. And then I had, first had a cigarette and a coffee and then I was fine. A short time framework later, I fell back in all the common suggestions that drinking, smoking, celebrating far too extensively is not good for you. And in this moment, I noticed the sticky manifestation again. I concentrated specifically on this expression.

I had the communication saying you are different, that I am different in my approach to celebrating, drinking, eating, smoking than commonly expressed. It seems to me that being different has been a concept for me so far in which I didn’t allow it to appreciate my preferences. I have been knowing almost all my focus that I am easy with all the suggested so-called biases because I like them. They are part of my preferences. But the sticky manifestation has not gone yet, and therefore I’ll ask you for some support. I feel the given example is only one expression of many which I have not noticed yet.

ELIAS: I am understanding. And in this, what you are doing is, as you generally do, creating some physical manifestation, in a manner of speaking, to alert you when you are discounting yourself in relation TO your preference. When you allow yourself to express your preference, but subsequently you question yourself or you discount yourself momentarily, you generally override that by expressing to yourself, “No. This is my preference.” But what is significant is to notice and genuinely address to those moments in which you are generating this automatic response of discounting yourself and attempting to deny your preference.

What you are actually doing is you allow yourself to express your preference, but subsequently you chide yourself for expressing your preference.

KATRIN: Mm. So, again I [inaudible]. Ja. Mm.

ELIAS: In that, you are noticing that you are momentarily chiding yourself for allowing yourself to engage your preferences, but rather than viewing that and examining that or evaluating it, you merely immediately override it by expressing a justification to yourself: “These are my preferences, therefore I can engage them.” You are justifying yourself, which is not necessary.

And if you are justifying, there remains some element within you that is questioning whether your preferences are actually good or not. This is similar to examples that I have offered previously in relation to individuals opposing their own preferences. They engage them, but they also oppose them.

Such as the example that I have offered previously of an individual that appreciates and expresses a preference for a tidy home but opposes themself in generating the actions to BE tidying their home. [2] In the opposition they become disgruntled with themself and express a thickness in themselves that they HAVE TO be tidying their home, that it is expected of them to be tidying of their home. But in actuality, that individual may incorporate a preference that their home IS tidy, but they generate other associations that are opposing of their own preference. They continue to do the actions, but in distress.

This is a similar expression. You allow yourself to generate the actions of your preferences, and you allow yourself to enjoy that, just as the individual allows themself to enjoy that their home is tidy, but you also generate an element of opposition in questioning whether that is actually a right preference or not. Which—

KATRIN: With practice, realizing what you really like to have or what you really like to do should get much less opposition energy, I think.

ELIAS: Yes.

KATRIN: I mean I can feel into your example of tidying a room; I'm quite similar to it. But in the meantime I felt very stressed by it, to do that. But in the meantime I just realized that I like to tidy up my house, and if I don’t feel like doing it I’m fine. I mean, this part of me is all the realizing what I like, and what you have explained to me, I think I will learn this celebrating as well. (Elias laughs) I want to continue to celebrate. (Both laugh) Ja. Thank you. This is the opposing your own preferences. I will remember that.

ELIAS: And this is also an involvement of fun.

KATRIN: Ja.

ELIAS: For in allowing yourself to generate these actions, you do enjoy it and you do incorporate fun, but there are some associations that fun is not necessarily responsible.

KATRIN: Okay. I could take this sentence. (Laughs) Oh ja. I can see it now.

ELIAS: Therefore, it becomes translated into the doubt of whether your preference is right or not.

KATRIN: Mm. Mm. Ja. Well, it’s very hard sometimes, if you are surrounded by suggestions the opposite way, to keep your preferences as the one you want to keep. So this is hard for me, not in general. I mean, I have other preferences where I am not feeling touched by outside suggestions. I think it’s practice.

ELIAS: Yes.

KATRIN: Mm. And just to remember not to oppose your own preferences. Thank you so much.

ELIAS: You are very welcome.

KATRIN: Coming back to the physical senses, it seems to me that all of this [inaudible] in my physical senses are related to my interactions with myself and with others. I feel quite comfortable with myself now, but my interactions with other individuals are not always to my liking. In addition to what you have explained to me today, can you give me some more information about my most current automatic responses in my interaction with others? It is my desire to accomplish the way how the little sapling expresses himself, but I feel I still snap when I am in interactions with others, and sometimes I just wonder what can I do to at least wait for half a minute or so before I snap and then I wouldn’t snap anyway.

ELIAS: And how do you define snap?

KATRIN: By reacting automatically when if somebody has a statement and I have a different opinion to it, instead of waiting for a second and explaining it in a calmer way I am very forceful in bringing my opinion on the table. And I feel this is often very repellent. I am not very nice in that way. People feel they are overwhelmed by me and oppose me – and I oppose them.

ELIAS: I would express first of all, when you feel that immediate automatic response, rather than immediately expressing, notice – for you are aware when it occurs – and even if you BEGIN to express, stop yourself and pause. And ask yourself one question: “Why is it necessary for me to be defending?” For that is the motivation for the automatic response.

When another individual expresses themself and you disagree, or you are expressing in a different direction as the other individual, if you are prompting yourself in an automatic response to challenge the other individual or to correct the other individual, what is motivating that is defense. You are feeling defensive, although you may not immediately recognize that, for it is so automatic and you are not pausing to evaluate what you are actually generating—you are merely reacting.

And in that, if, even if you BEGIN to react, this is significant, for you are aware of what you are doing when you are doing it. Therefore, if you begin to react, recognizing that, allow yourself to stop and pause momentarily, and merely ask yourself that one question.

KATRIN: Mm-hm. It relates to what we have discussed one or two sessions before about identity, I think. What am I defending, is my question immediately. I am defending my identity. It that what you mean?

ELIAS: I would express yes, there is an involvement of that quite strongly. For when another individual is expressing their opinion in any particular subject and it is different from yours, what occurs inwardly is that you automatically begin to question whether you are right or not, for the other individual is expressing differently. And you IMMEDIATELY move in the direction of assessing that the other individual is wrong and you are right, and now you are in defense.

KATRIN: Mm-hm. I’m looking forward to when I can express my opinion without being forceful and without being judgmental. I’m looking forward to it. (Elias laughs) I think I will accomplish it one day. (Laughs)

ELIAS: And I am quite sure that you will. I would express to you, my friend, this is associated with being comfortable and satisfied within yourself. When you are genuinely comfortable and satisfied within yourself, there is no necessity to defend. Even if other individuals express very differently, you do not feel threatened by those differences, and therefore it is not necessary to react.

KATRIN: You know what? I feel already so comfortable and satisfied at the moment. (Both laugh) Oh well. We won’t have instant satisfaction, not to respond in that forceful manner towards other people. I will see. It’s fun to do it anyway.

ELIAS: I would express to you a congratulations, for it begins in the now. And therefore, you are accomplishing now being comfortable and satisfied, and this is your practice.

KATRIN: Thank you. (Both laugh)

Now I want to talk about creating with an awareness how I create. So far this sentence “You create your own reality” is still a concept for me. I get glimpses nowadays that it is me who creates, but I have no feeling for it. I give an example of one of the glimpses without really knowing how I do it. This is what I want to check with you.

I have enough money. I generate it almost without doing something for it. My motivation to have money is that I want to travel, buy things for myself, my grandsons, friends, have sessions with you and all the joyful actions. I can do all the things which are important to me. What surprises me is how it comes along that I have a constant source of funds. I’m not concentrating on money; I’m concentrated on my desires, my wishes, and hardly concern myself with the money. Is this how you create: you have desires, preferences, what you want to do and how you want to do it, and you are just concentrating upon it? Your example with the leprechaun [1] suggests it. But you have to be quite genuine with yourself, what you really like. I don’t like gardening, and therefore to wish for a house with a beautiful garden isn’t a genuine wish for me. Therefore, I have a house with a terrace and sunroom. Am I correct to say that getting aware of “You create your own reality” is feeling into your likes, preferences, wishes, desires and being very precise, what you really want?

ELIAS: Yes. And knowing that you can have it, and knowing you can do it.

KATRIN: Oh. Trusting yourself—

ELIAS: Yes.

KATRIN: — in this process, that you can have it and you can do it.

ELIAS: Yes.

KATRIN: Mm-hm. (Sighs) It sounds so easy.

ELIAS: And also, crediting yourself. This is an enormous factor with most individuals. Most individuals only credit themselves with their creation if they themself have physically produced some manifestation or action.

As the example, an individual may express their want to travel, and they may travel. But perhaps they are traveling with a friend or a companion, and they credit the other individual with creating that and will actually express, “I do not actually travel; my friend or my companion took me with them.” Therefore, they are not crediting themself with what they are actually doing. They ARE actually traveling, but they credit another individual or another source with their own creation.

This occurs very often in association with money with individuals. It matters not HOW money is created. If it is in your possession, you have created it. But, generally speaking, most individuals credit some other source with the creation of money, and they express that they themselves acquired it. They did not create it, they acquired it, for some other source created it and gave it to them.

This is what creates that block in generating the ability to actually, genuinely experience that you ARE actually creating every expression within your reality. But this one factor is immense.

KATRIN: You mean whatever you… I mean, I would stop at I enjoy. The things which I don’t enjoy, I have my body signals anyway to make me aware of it, but whatever you enjoy really, to sit down – I mean, I have to do this – to sit down and just give credit for yourself, that is a beginning to feel how you create?

ELIAS: Yes.

KATRIN: That’s what you’re saying?

ELIAS: Yes. For this is one significant factor that most individuals, for the most part, do not do. They do not credit themselves with what they are actually creating.

KATRIN: Even if I don’t know, as I express in this question, “I don’t know.” I mean, I credit myself for having a comfortable life, because the money comes in. I’m crediting myself for that one. But I don’t know how it comes along, so even that I could say, well, give yourself credit and one day you will find out how it worked or how it came along. Is that what you mean?

ELIAS: Yes. For it matters not how you are drawing that to yourself, other than the recognition that your energy is being projected every moment of your existence, and your energy serves as a type of immense magnet that encircles you. And in that, in every direction that magnet is pulling to it whatever matches the energy that is being expressed through the magnet.

KATRIN: For example, say I want to continue to have sessions with you and I need funds for it. I’m not asking for the funds; I am asking for sessions with you. This is what I am putting out in energy.

ELIAS: Yes.

KATRIN: The wish.

ELIAS: Yes. And therefore, your magnet seeks out whatever matches that in every area to allow you to accomplish that. And when you are not doubting, and when you are not concerning yourself in relation to the subject, you very effectively draw to yourself or create what you require to accomplish what you want.

KATRIN: Mm-hm. But it’s not that important to ask HOW it came along; it’s more important for me to say I… yes, to credit myself—

ELIAS: Yes.

KATRIN: --for what comes along. (Laughs)

ELIAS: Yes. And to know that the manner in which you create more intentionally all that you want is to be aware of what type of energy you are projecting. And the manner in which you are aware of what you are projecting outwardly is to pay attention to what you are doing.

KATRIN: In this example from today, if I continue to project defensive energy, it ripples out to all the other fields of my life, of my focus life—is this what you say? I mean…

ELIAS: Yes. For it is all interconnected.

KATRIN: Mm-hm. I have read it all in the digest, but it’s more clearer to me now. Thank you very much.

ELIAS: (Chuckles) Are you familiar with a phrase that many individuals express when they are experiencing considerable negative occurrences and they express, “It never rains but it pours”?

KATRIN: Mm-hm.

ELIAS: In that, the reason that that is actually quite accurate is that when an individual is expressing some type of what you would term to be negative energy, as all IS interconnected, that energy flows outwardly in all directions. And therefore, their magnet seeks out any expression that will match the energy that they are expressing outwardly. And therefore, for a time framework the individual will experience many different actions occurring that are uncomfortable or distressing.

But it moves in similar manner with what you want. When you are not doubting, when you projecting an energy in association with your preferences and you are expressing in confidence, which is trusting, you project THAT in all directions, and you begin to draw to yourself what you DO want.

KATRIN: Well, I’ve noticed for… I mean, I have just very comfortable, very comfortable experiences at the moment. I’m noticing that in this situation you are much bolder in your expressions. You are much more confident. And I really like it. And when you have that experience or you are aware or you notice that, then there is a natural desire to continue. I think that this is the way I can digest it, just to remind myself how easy it was.

ELIAS: Yes. And in actuality, contrary to what most individuals think, generating what you want incorporates much less energy and is much easier than generating what you do not want.

KATRIN: Ja. You know, the expression that we can change our reality has been for me much focus on the actual physical expressions. It irritated me a bit that I don’t want to change too much of my physical surroundings, as I am not missing anything. Physically, I have enough of everything what matters to me. But now I start to see what it means that I can change my reality. I am changing the process how I create – even I don’t know how I do it right now, it is getting more fluid, lighter and easier.

And this is an experience which is quite powerful, even it’s so foggy for me, because I would like to experience in every moment this powerful energy I have, to manipulate it. But the feeling of getting so fluid, so easy, it’s a wonderful experience, and I think I would like to continue like this. (Both laugh)

And I know at the moment how I want to live in this stage in this focus physically, and I have accomplished it. And I trust myself to continue to do so. Even I scratch my eyes literally often in this time framework asking myself how it all came along, and now I want to stop to ask how. I will just credit myself.

Now I’m starting to be curious what I do with myself after knowing what I like in my physical expressions, which might change, and being able to provide myself with it. I feel pretty comfortable and satisfied with myself. But it is getting so much easier now that I could take on another challenge. Would you mind giving me a clue how I can start to feel, to experience even much more how to manipulate energy? Just a suggestion apart from crediting myself? Is there anything I could play with or try or just having fun?

ELIAS: (Chuckles) I would express that in this time framework, allowing yourself to play with your preferences is one excellent practice, and the other practice is the pausing practice, which indeed will be a challenge. (Both laugh)

KATRIN: Yes.

ELIAS: Therefore, if you are looking for a challenge, you have already provided yourself with one. (Both laugh)

KATRIN: Oh yeah. Yes. (Elias laughs) That’s all right. (Laughs) The pausing practice. (Elias laughs) This I will call it, the Pausing Practice. (Both laugh) It's a new game for me, the PP Game. Okay. (Both laugh) Okay. Yes. I want to do that. I asked for it, now I got it. (Both laugh)

ELIAS: Aha! Indeed, you did. (Both laugh)

KATRIN: Ja. Okay. I think I’ll stop for today. I have no idea what I want to ask you now. (Laughs) The PP takes my attention now. (Elias laughs) I will pause now. (Both laugh)

ELIAS: Very well. And perhaps futurely, when you are engaging your PP, you will also engage laughter. (Both laugh)

KATRIN: Yes. (Laughs) Much easier, actually.

ELIAS: Rather than opposition. (Laughs)

KATRIN: Mm-hm. That’s a good one. (Both laugh)

So, I’m looking forward to seeing you in Vienna.

ELIAS: And I shall be anticipating our objective meeting also. (Chuckles) To you, as always, my dear friend, in great appreciation, in dear friendship and as always, offering continuous supportiveness to you, au revoir.

KATRIN: Au revoir. Thank you.

[1] Session 2227

[2] Session 2051

(Elias departs after 58 minutes)